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March 2010 "Edison" Format

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+Urthor    10221

The idea you'd play Blackwings and not max out Skill Drain and Royal Oppression in your main is insane.  irrc I won the edison tournament with oppression in the side but that was only because I didn't want Oppression vs Allen who was my opponent in the semifinals.  The literal point of Blackwings is "hey I play all of these absurd power cards other decks don't play, tremble before me" and you are just better card for card than the other decks, and skill drain is by and large a better fiendish chain most of the time.  

 

Also 3x fossil dyna in the side that card is just the best at life the universe and everything.  

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Brandis72    9

Yeah, BW needs floods; the deck's monster engine is noticeably worse than that of plants, and massively worse than that of frogs: the most consistent way it wins is just by drawing floods and whirlwind, both of which are obscene and are capable of winning by themselves if you resolve them with a stable hand.

I wasn't sure about maining more than 2 skill drain, but then again; the point still stands.

Edited by Brandis72

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Best    68

Haven't been playing Yugioh at all for the last few years but recently, my friends and I picked back up on this format. Does anyone have innovation on Caliber Cat lists, or are Cat variants just inferior to QDP for the most part and not worth it?

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+Urthor    10221
6 hours ago, Best said:

Haven't been playing Yugioh at all for the last few years but recently, my friends and I picked back up on this format. Does anyone have innovation on Caliber Cat lists, or are Cat variants just inferior to QDP for the most part and not worth it?

 

Cat variants are basically a general "good stuff" deck because you just play standard traps, good cards like Doomcal, lots of traps and rescue cat because rescue cat is kind of neat.  Cat has a losing matchup to quickdraw overall just because QDP generally just executes its combos pre side and those are powerful enough you win the matchup a lot of the time, and cat by and large is just playing a lot of generic traps.  Obv Cat can still godhand though.  

 

The metagame for Edison that came out of the Duelistgroundz tournament was Frog Monarchs/Blackwings/QDP, and Hero beat as a sort of tier 2 goodstuff that lost pretty hard to Frogmonarchs and did okay vs QDP and got out grinded by Bwings.  Cat is an inferior goodstuff to hero beat I think?  Just because it's core is kind of worse than heroes and it doesn't do much to that "Big 3" that Hero doesn't do, and Blackwings is kind of the best goodstuff just because hey Whirlwind Icarus Drain Oppression are just nice Yugioh cards and you fill your deck with those. 

 

Glad Beast are the QDP counter that is pretty good at being a goodstuff deck, want to have fun and wreck your QDP playing friends play Glad beasts the matchup is insane, and I don't remember the frog matchup for GB.  

 

It could probably be more explored, but that's what we came out of it with.  I don't have any lists because they all evaporated with DN but I love this format it was one of my favourite theory-ohs and I will try to dig some stuff up.   I'll do my best to dig some stuff up.  


oh also Gadgets.  Gadgets were super neat as well.  Cat/Gadgets/Hero beat were sort of the tier 2 that smashed GB and lost to the combo decks, Frog and QDP, and Blackwing ground out.    

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NB96    795

The next DGz Live will be this format most likely. It's good to see this thread getting more interest again. I've been liking Frog Monarch a lot personally.

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+Urthor    10221

 

alright neato did find the old decklists from Edison.  Dprison and something else to the side for the Oppressions.  

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+mmf    23221
On 9/21/2017 at 6:29 PM, Urthor said:

The idea you'd play Blackwings and not max out Skill Drain and Royal Oppression in your main is insane.  irrc I won the edison tournament with oppression in the side but that was only because I didn't want Oppression vs Allen who was my opponent in the semifinals.  The literal point of Blackwings is "hey I play all of these absurd power cards other decks don't play, tremble before me" and you are just better card for card than the other decks, and skill drain is by and large a better fiendish chain most of the time.  

 

Also 3x fossil dyna in the side that card is just the best at life the universe and everything.  

I no longer think that 2 Oppression 2 Drain is optimal in the main. Skill Drain is in fact not a better fiendish chain most of the time. One of the best parts of Fiendish Chain is that you can actually just flip it at any point in the game without consequence, whereas when you only have Skill Drain you have to hold it until after key Shura/Blizzard resolutions, etc (unless you're playing against Frog Monarch, in which case it's probably correct to just jam it on the first monster effect you see). Also, if your opening turns involve a bunch of Icarus Attack trades, Skill Drain will often be a literal dead card while topdecking while Fiendish Chain might actually help you survive and get back into the game. I should probably be maining a second Oppression, I just don't know what I'd cut.

 

 

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+Urthor    10221
7 hours ago, mmf said:

I no longer think that 2 Oppression 2 Drain is optimal in the main. Skill Drain is in fact not a better fiendish chain most of the time. One of the best parts of Fiendish Chain is that you can actually just flip it at any point in the game without consequence, whereas when you only have Skill Drain you have to hold it until after key Shura/Blizzard resolutions, etc (unless you're playing against Frog Monarch, in which case it's probably correct to just jam it on the first monster effect you see). Also, if your opening turns involve a bunch of Icarus Attack trades, Skill Drain will often be a literal dead card while topdecking while Fiendish Chain might actually help you survive and get back into the game. I should probably be maining a second Oppression, I just don't know what I'd cut.

 

 

 

Skill drain is amazing vs your two worst matchups, Quickdraw and Frog Monarchs, and the deck is 45-55 minimum vs Frognarchs it's not an advantageous matchup.  If you are grinding games vs the other matchups where skill drain isn't a complete blowout then you probably have to think about it.  

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+mmf    23221

bLACKWINGS >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> QUICKDRAW

 

idk how that's one of the hardest matchups at all, in my eyes its one of the easiest

 

and i think i prefer fiendish over skill drain vs them because you can do things like fiendish their debris, summon shura, attack over it, shit on and around their mouth

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Best    68
14 hours ago, Urthor said:

 

Cat variants are basically a general "good stuff" deck because you just play standard traps, good cards like Doomcal, lots of traps and rescue cat because rescue cat is kind of neat.  Cat has a losing matchup to quickdraw overall just because QDP generally just executes its combos pre side and those are powerful enough you win the matchup a lot of the time, and cat by and large is just playing a lot of generic traps.  Obv Cat can still godhand though.  

 

The metagame for Edison that came out of the Duelistgroundz tournament was Frog Monarchs/Blackwings/QDP, and Hero beat as a sort of tier 2 goodstuff that lost pretty hard to Frogmonarchs and did okay vs QDP and got out grinded by Bwings.  Cat is an inferior goodstuff to hero beat I think?  Just because it's core is kind of worse than heroes and it doesn't do much to that "Big 3" that Hero doesn't do, and Blackwings is kind of the best goodstuff just because hey Whirlwind Icarus Drain Oppression are just nice Yugioh cards and you fill your deck with those. 

 

Glad Beast are the QDP counter that is pretty good at being a goodstuff deck, want to have fun and wreck your QDP playing friends play Glad beasts the matchup is insane, and I don't remember the frog matchup for GB.  

 

It could probably be more explored, but that's what we came out of it with.  I don't have any lists because they all evaporated with DN but I love this format it was one of my favourite theory-ohs and I will try to dig some stuff up.   I'll do my best to dig some stuff up.  


oh also Gadgets.  Gadgets were super neat as well.  Cat/Gadgets/Hero beat were sort of the tier 2 that smashed GB and lost to the combo decks, Frog and QDP, and Blackwing ground out.    

Thanks Urthor, I think my friends have come to the conclusion that it wasn't very fun to play Frognarchs, nor was it very fun to play against it so we kinda just have that deck to the side atm. I do want to explore Glads again as I don't recall people playing RespiteGlads during this time, but it was something I played with when TSHD came out I think so I'll probably sleeve that up eventually. This format has been nothing but fun since we brought it up. We got a few more people to play and everyone loves it. As for Hero Beat, is it the Little City variant or is Skyscraper played?

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NB96    795

Are Gadgets are too risky to use now? I know Doomcal Gadgets got second at Edison but with Firedogs and Shura running around you probably don't want to be leaving your Gadgets to get eaten and let them pump out a Vayu/level 8 synchro.

 

Quickdraw variants were also popular in the Live, was Urthor right to say GB's are a good counterpick? I still think they might be worth exploring.

 

The tournament was only 8 players though so I don't think I should bother analysing much, the one with 50 odd players is a better indicator.

Edited by NB96

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+Gemstone Mine    2595

doomcal is dogshit now. You have to consider, at the time, cat was iirc the most represented deck and doomcal is pretty good vs it. That's no longer a thing, and quickdraw isn't as bothered by it, and frogs laugh at your waste of a normal summon. I think more standard machina gadgets with lots of traps are fine as a deck though.

 

GBs are fantastic vs quickdraw and frog varients, the problem is the BW match-up. Part of me suspects it's not as bad as people think and GBs are definitely a contender though.

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Soul    8021

i think allen's deck was kinda poorly built. i have tested the concept before and feel like there are a few cards he could've played. 

 

as far as gadgets, i dont think the deck is very good either. not that every other deck is unfair, gadgets are just fairer. you cant expect to win with the gadgets alone, so not playing the machina engine imo is kind've dumb. kind've helps w the monarch matchup and beats over a lot of things (gearframes stats are pretty relevant for shura/GB crashes and fortress crashes with SD). 

 

GB is always a pretty solid call you just need to know how to play it and play carefully. everyone ive seen playing GB throws bestiari into multiple backrow, usually a BTH with no BoM, and after that happens your opponent can just reasonably flood you knowing your only destruction is murmillo. also has a pretty bad BW matchup but that can be mitigated w well-timed s/t destruction and protection via SLR

 

 

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If someone want to teach me more about this format, I would really appreciate it. I'm new to this format, as I stopped playing after perfect circle format (sept 2007). I know how the mechanics work but I know nothing about strategies comboes etc.

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