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Dirk    1956

exciton just rarely comes up I think, and he probably just valued the 2nd castel since he could make one raw then the other off charge.

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Suuwo    647

It probably comes up a lot more often if you do the soul charge opener with castel and beast where you use castel to flip it down. In this case castel is being used to set-up your board while the second one is probably going to be used to clear a threat. Each castel serves a different purpose.

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+Urthor    10236

Excition doesn't come up rarely at all I just think Pat was a little bit retarded and went too much on theory like "making an XYZ with the mini dragons sucks from a card advantage perspective, and excition is not an XYZ you want to make off Soul Charge" not enough on actually grinding shit out to find conclusions like "yeah excition might be bad in theory, but I've played 100 games and excition is still fundamentally one of the most powerful cards in Yugioh despite those drawbacks, and the ability to simplify the gamestate, then Soul Charge for 4, is ridiculous"

 

 

Excition comes up sooo much.  

 

 

Also this whole not playing Foolish burial thing.  Foolish burial is a better upstart goblin when you have 3 beast.  It actually just is, it's upstart except it thins THREE cards from your deck, not 1, and sets up your grave.  

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+Urthor    10236
Yeah I know that that is the theory Klevis. But like, you never really should be soul charging into a field blow up ever except in some really absurd gamestates. I never use excition that way and nor should you ever really.
 
The issue is that well, I've played a lot with Excition using the 3 Raiden 4 mini dragon build, and it's won numerous games, and it's been a threat your opponent has had to play around very hard.  My opponent's just can't let me excition when I have two lvl 4s, so they are forced into flipping vanity early, or into using super poly on one of my level 4s
 
Plays like that come up so much.  Especially the super poly 1, it's just the worst paradox where they can either risk the excition blowing their field up, or wasting a super poly and letting me potentially get off Shaddoll fusion, or soul charge into Castel/Volca/etcetera.  
 
Someone times the on paper theory doesn't match up to the reality that Excition is just a major major threat.  And yes, I'm not an idiot, I generally don't go into excition when I have a good read that they have solemn warning/bts to out it.
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crowstar    25

I personally think exciton should be included because

1) for a card to be used in the extra  we have to consider what card it will replace, and I'm just not sure that the second castel is more valuable than exciton because

2) exciton when it resolves usually ends the game right there especially in a build with 3 soul charge. That card will win games on it's on and so your opponent either loses or has to play extremely awkwardly to avoid that.

 

On another point does anyone else brick hard with the lightsworn build? I've been testing it for a few weeks but I dropped it to wait for hoban's list because I couldn't solve the brick hands issue, but he didn't really do anything about that either. Some games opening all chaos monsters, or not getting the right colour in grave fast enough to get things going has been particularly problematic. I was testing kuribandit as a 1 card hand fixer but with the more conservative shaddoll engine I just ran out of steam. It could be that I'm unlucky/bad but I was wondering how others have found opening multiple chaos monsters which also weakens soul charge (banishing dolls when you're desperate). 

 

Also have people cut leo? I thought raiden + sorc into leo was pretty strong and it's so good against BA I couldn't see myself not playing really...

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DarthRevan    2

The issue is that well, I've played a lot with Excition using the 3 Raiden 4 mini dragon build, and it's won numerous games, and it's been a threat your opponent has had to play around very hard.  My opponent's just can't let me excition when I have two lvl 4s, so they are forced into flipping vanity early, or into using super poly on one of my level 4s
 

Wait, why do they have to super poly your level 4s? Why not just wait for exciton then respond to the summon? I mean, you can't chain eciton to the super poly. That's how I destroyed a tellar knight player.

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»Sharpman    4801

Yeah I know that that is the theory Klevis. But like, you never really should be soul charging into a field blow up ever except in some really absurd gamestates. I never use excition that way and nor should you ever really.
 
The issue is that well, I've played a lot with Excition using the 3 Raiden 4 mini dragon build, and it's won numerous games, and it's been a threat your opponent has had to play around very hard.  My opponent's just can't let me excition when I have two lvl 4s, so they are forced into flipping vanity early, or into using super poly on one of my level 4s
 
Plays like that come up so much.  Especially the super poly 1, it's just the worst paradox where they can either risk the excition blowing their field up, or wasting a super poly and letting me potentially get off Shaddoll fusion, or soul charge into Castel/Volca/etcetera.  
 
Someone times the on paper theory doesn't match up to the reality that Excition is just a major major threat.  And yes, I'm not an idiot, I generally don't go into excition when I have a good read that they have solemn warning/bts to out it.


Exciton doesn't need to be in your extra deck for your opponent to play around it just saying
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DarthRevan    2

Because pretty sure because he is the turn player, he gets to use exciton before you can super poly.

You are correct, sorry Urthor. I had never seen exciton used as a chain link 1 on summon before and always assumed the opponent could respond to a summon before the turn player. Guess the tellarknight guy I played misplayed.

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»Sharpman    4801

The fuck are you talking about? Unless I'm mistaken, you are still playing like prio is a thing. You can respond to a summon before a "Once per turn:" type effect is activated. 

 

exciton is a spell speed 2 effect its different.

 

I can torrential my own summon before my opponent can, exciton is no different. 

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DaveW    50
http://www.yugioh-card.com/en/gameplay/images/T-Flowchart_EN-US.jpg

if we follow Konami's fast effect timing chart, you start at a, the big green box.

then, you follow the arrow to the blue box on the left because the turn player is doing an action that is not starting a chain. The xyz summon of exciton does not start a chain.

after that, following the arrow goes to "does this activate a triggerred effect". An effect that automatically activates on a monster's summon, such as deneb or black garden. Since this does not* apply, following the arrow goes to:

Turn player can activate a fast effect, in this case its exciton's own effect.

Following the arrow down even further is where it says the opponent can activate a fast effect, such as super poly. But this comes after the opportunity for when exciton can use his own effect.

Edit: ah sorry, got ninja'd

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Rising    33

Also this whole not playing Foolish burial thing.  Foolish burial is a better upstart goblin when you have 3 beast.  It actually just is, it's upstart except it thins THREE cards from your deck, not 1, and sets up your grave.  

I think he played the third Upstart over Foolish Burial because Upstart can help you dig for an out to a floodgate whereas Foolish Burial is just another card that's rendered useless by that floodgate. 

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atem16    283
Play testing with hobans build I'm finding it either starts off Well or it bricks and there will be times I just mill my fusions /super poly it's the main reason I didn't like random milling in here
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DarthRevan    2

http://i.imgur.com/xfD12eR.png

 

2nd place list at Houston Regionals

When I see this I think: "Is there really NOTHING in his deck that he can cut to have 40 cards? Not ONE card?" It looks like he could cut an MST, Dragon, BoM, squamata, lyla or Breakthough skill and have 40 cards. He could even fit in a third emptiness.

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Zach Butler    54

If we arent playing ad changer,why would we play hound

level 4, decent stats, another doll, and works during either turn when sent

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atem16    283
I feel that the artifact and the dragon variant are really close in the good builds for shaddoll but one is control while the other is more aggro

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abbádon    37

[spoiler]

 zKvh96f.png

[/spoiler]

 

took this to a case tournament last night, splitting top 4 since it was already like 4am. its pretty much hobans list,but i swapped one shadow games for foolish, and the side and extra are a little different, doing the morning at my locals i was playing his exact list and i hated the dark chaos dragon so much. I always milled spells instead of monsters with raiden/lyla  random milling pretty much just sucks, but if you ever have raiden and a chaos dragon live your able to just put tons of pressure on your oppnt, and it almost always forced them to go into the extra to deal with it making the shaddolls fusions live.

 

I switched the 3 beast to 3 dragon since if i was to draw any shaddoll i want it to be dragon. tellars have to either go in to the extra to deal with him or use backrow and having super poly in hand along with that dragon will pretty much win you the matchup with just those two cards. 

 

honestly wish i had more time to test, but between school work and, a vacation coming up i haven't even looked at yugioh in over a month, so i was thankful that hoban was able to see success with this build so that he would release it and give me a short-cut to playing. since rather then spending hours doing effective testing just to find a build that works, then testing to see how it works with all the matchups i was able to eliminate  the first portion and just focus on learning the combos and what to do in what match-up, obviously if i am going to continue playing after the list i will have to put in the time to play all of the builds, but it was nice to be able to take a list and just play it.

 

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Zach Butler    54

 

Got 4th in maplewood with this build yesterday: http://i.imgur.com/Kc6KIJD.png

Congrats on the top how did it play out? Any changes you would make to it?

 

Uh maybe take out dad and stuff, its very bad outside of ideal situations. but overall i loved the list. The deck played out pretty standardly. Only a couple like, ridiculous moments (I opened mathematician and 3 shadow games...you can't lose that). That mained Caius ruled the day, wrecking tellars and mirrors. 

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