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Patrick Hoban And The Djinn Debate

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Gabe3Vino    77

I would hardly call Julia's [or anyone's for that matter] opinion the end to this matter. It was Kevin Tewart's opinion that Sangan should get his effect when detached as Xyz material, and we see where that got us.

 

The only long-term 'opinion' that matters is that of an official release by Konami, and I'm pretty sure that won't happen, given how rarely Konami as a business group actually doles out information in situations such as these. Until that happens, the only opinion that actually holds any bearing to players is that of the head judge of whatever event they might be attending, because that's the only person who actually has any power in a controversial matter like this. 

 

IMO:

This entire issue is the result of Konami's trend of asking the players and judges to be responsible for interpreting complex events from simple text. Obviously this is something that is not so clear cut, and so every player/judge is going to have a different interpretation of whether it is technically ok or not ok. Everyone is going to read the document text differently, and everyone is going to interpret the player's actions differently. But at least in my opinion, I don't see how this isn't unsportsmanlike conduct. The majority of people seem to agree this is a shitty thing to do; Well I don't understand how they can't see "unsportsmanlike conduct" as just saying "shitty thing to do" in a few less words. 

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Dramus18    9
So, sorry if this is a stupid question, but do we actually know/have good reason to suspect Pat actually did this, or did people see the second Djinn in Ben's list and assume the worst? Since Zodiac's involved I feel the need to ask the question.

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SpiceyYanni1    333

why does this have 37 threadsalso, good to see that julia's put an end to the matter - this is a case where the entire corps felt rather split, and she's the only tiebreaker we all have.


What do you mean Julia put an end to this matter? I didn't see anything about Any sort of statement regarding this

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harig07    2058

Why would there be any need for a Konami official to say anything? If being a dick were illegal we'd all be banned

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»ACP    33422

I would hardly call Julia's [or anyone's for that matter] opinion the end to this matter. It was Kevin Tewart's opinion that Sangan should get his effect when detached as Xyz material, and we see where that got us.

 

The only long-term 'opinion' that matters is that of an official release by Konami, and I'm pretty sure that won't happen, given how rarely Konami as a business group actually doles out information in situations such as these. Until that happens, the only opinion that actually holds any bearing to players is that of the head judge of whatever event they might be attending, because that's the only person who actually has any power in a controversial matter like this. 

 

IMO:

This entire issue is the result of Konami's trend of asking the players and judges to be responsible for interpreting complex events from simple text. Obviously this is something that is not so clear cut, and so every player/judge is going to have a different interpretation of whether it is technically ok or not ok. Everyone is going to read the document text differently, and everyone is going to interpret the player's actions differently. But at least in my opinion, I don't see how this isn't unsportsmanlike conduct. The majority of people seem to agree this is a shitty thing to do; Well I don't understand how they can't see "unsportsmanlike conduct" as just saying "shitty thing to do" in a few less words. 

Well first of all, we shouldn't have needed to ask Julia. Anyone objectively reading Konami policies without inserting their own emotional desire to put a stop to apparent scumbaggery would have reached the obvious conclusion that sidedecking tricks are perfectly fine.

 

But since Julia did go ahead and tell everyone that sidedecking tricks don't violate policy, yes this issue is effectively solved, and anyone who thinks otherwise is in denial. If you don't trust the person whose job it is to write TCG policy that sidedecking tricks don't violate TCG policy, well then sorry but you're retarded.

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»ACP    33422

 

why does this have 37 threadsalso, good to see that julia's put an end to the matter - this is a case where the entire corps felt rather split, and she's the only tiebreaker we all have.


What do you mean Julia put an end to this matter? I didn't see anything about Any sort of statement regarding this

 

As I posted earlier in this very thread...

 

http://duelistgroundz.com/index.php?showtopic=164562

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+scuzzlebutt    23495

Scummy or not, it's pretty pathetic that one of the best players in this game has to result to a tactic as desperate as this.

u mean 'resort'
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+scuzzlebutt    23495
MAN I CANT BELIEVE PATICK HOBAM HAVE TO RESULT TO PLAY NEKROX TO WIN A REAL DUELIST WOULD PLAY GOAT CONTROL EVERY FORMAT
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Facebook    70

MAN I CANT BELIEVE PATICK HOBAM HAVE TO RESULT TO PLAY NEKROX TO WIN A REAL DUELIST WOULD PLAY GOAT CONTROL EVERY FORMAT


It's a phone typo. Calm down.
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+scuzzlebutt    23495
yeah sorry you had such a good point buried under the typo i should have given it more attention
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Facebook    70
Yeah I mean, I'm sorry we don't all have the same opinions as the famous and successful DG poster 'Dennis frogman'
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+scuzzlebutt    23495
yeah its hard to be me
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+scuzzlebutt    23495
esp for u
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+Urthor    10225
People need to get over themselves and accept that pushing the rules to the edge of their envelope for success in big tournament sis an objectively valid, and encouragable behaviour, and stop getting butt thrust about it. The end.

Not being a nice guy at locals, ok, not being a nice guy at premier events, that's like, the point no?

It might not be what you'll do, but if it's legal and it helps them win, don't get on someone's case about it lol.
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people are making this out like pat got caught stacking after all of his success, its hilarious. he did nothing wrong, even this weekend his tactic was only going to catch out idiots, if i see lance game 1 im going to assume multiple djinn (at least after prague weekend) and go from there.

 

this is like patrick discovering some next level play, not telling anyone about it then beating people with it. everyone knows about it now and now it isnt as strong as it was before (still only catching out the ignorant). gotta stay ahead of the curve ;)

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skullvarnish    378

I guess I've always been one to see the siding out thing to be silly ever since Sixth Sense and Return sort of started the whole trend. It seemed like the whole thing was asking to be abused, and I don't really hold anger towards anyone who sort of "lies" and doesn't side the cards out, or sides in another copy, or whichever. It's a bit shady, but I don't feel it was "wrong". It broke no game rules, and I see it as a mind game more than a malicious lie. I totally get why people are upset though, but I think people shouldn't be getting as upset as they are.

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skullvarnish    378

I mean except the fact you are just straight up wrong. The tactics Steve Klaus uses, and Dalton Bousman, etc are generally accepted as wrong to do, even though they are legal by the letter. Why would this be ANY different? I think because of who he is and who he claims to be, and who he wants to be the "best player" in the game, this is objectively just as bad.

You can tell this game has completely and utterly gone to shit when we begin to defend people who do things like this, instead of publicly shame them and protect the game from becoming a shit show. Like seriously, if you haven't gathered at this point in your life that just because something isn't illegal, doesn't mean it's not unethical. And if you are one of those people who subcribes to this notion, you are very depersonalized, and probably just a complete asshole, and a Republican.

You raise a great point, actually, and I'm sure some of his defenders may see it that way, but I'd like to think that if it had been a regular player, most people would feel exactly the same. But I guess that's mostly wishful thinking.

 

 

EDIT: Sorry for double post, thought it would auto-merge.

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klaus - admitted to cheating on video, record of slowplay/manipulating end of match procedure as well as general scummery.

 

dalton - record of slowplay, general unsporting conduct in game (his tactic to mind game the opp), as well as general scummery

 

 

both are banned/have been penalized for these reasons. the only thing they're doing that is in a grey area (grey because it's so hard to police) is manipulating the end of match procedure, everything else is just stone against policy.

 

this isn't anywhere close to the shit they've pulled.

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Nelrick    2392

Maybe if it had been klaus or dalton, or another player already known for doing scummy tricks, the witch hunt would have already begun.

Idk, maybe if it had been alex keeler we would have seen a thread from hoban about how he is total shit etc etc.

But its patrick hoban so opinions are mixed.

 

"what a scumbag"

"nah man fuk u mind games for lyfe go dalton bousman"

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»ACP    33422

Yeah I mean Klaus and Dalton are actual cheaters lol. Comparing Hoban to them is completely unfair.

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Soul    7944
I guess man. There's just no winning with you guys. Just when that whole shit with Dalton happened to tilt Loli, there was a bunch of people putting him down. Now that Patrick was basically doing something different, but along the same legal/moral grey line, suddenly everything changes. Because it only caught morons? I guess Loli is quite the moron since Daltons tactic was legal and worked on him!
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Soul    7944
And the whole thing that took place against Loli. Let's not forget that Patrick was the same exact person who facilitated that whole scenario and made it possible btw. SAME EXACT PERSON.
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slickz    4309
It's scummy, unethical, lacking of integrity, disrepectful. Something to be said about keeping your word, not just with yugioh.

Anywho, I hope people just straight up start saying "no" when asked to side out shit.

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