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petqwe

OCG Burning Abyss asking for help / advice

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petqwe    286

Since this is almost the end of the OCG format, I think I better grab this last chance to figure out what this deck aims to do.

 

Decklist

 

Picture:

[spoiler]

85M946.png

[/spoiler]

Text:

[spoiler]

Monsters:

3 Veiler

3 Tour Guide

1 Rhino

3 Cir

3 Graff

3 Scarm

1 Farfa

1 Cagna

 

Spells:

1 Duster

3 Mask Change Second

1 G&E

2 Twin Twister

 

Traps:

3 XYZ Universe

3 Solemn Notice

1 Solemn Judgment

3 Anti-spell fragrance

3 Compulsory

1 Horn of Heaven

1 Fire Lake

 

Extra:

1 Dark Law

1 Anki

1 Pilgram

1 Virgil

3 Dante

3 Beatrice

1 Phantom Knight of the Broken Sword

1 Granpulse

1 Kali Yuga

1 Infinity

1 Ultimatrainer

 

Side:

3 Maxx C (BA, potentially also EMEm first)

1 Dark Hole (EMEm second)

2 Mirror of Ice Barrier (BA)

2 Creature Swap (BA)

1 Skill Drain (EMEm first)

1 Storming Mirror Force (BA)

3 Typhoon (EMEm second)

1 THIRO (Twin Twister / people who dont fucking side out Fire Lake)

[/spoiler]

 

Changes:

 

1. Replaced Maxx C with Veiler. I saw the shitstorm of Deck Discussion about why people should not play Veiler. True that I will never touch Veiler in current TCG format, but this card is the most reliable answer to Pendulum Magician, one of the cards that push EMEm to the top tier. I feel that Maxx C does not warrant a main deck space since I just don't care whether they go nuts with Dracorival - that is neither a Pendulum  Magician nor a Shock, why should I care?

2. Mained Mask Change Second: While I don't play Maxx C myself, I cannot assure my opponent doesn't. This card perfectly answers Maxx C: set backrow and pass, so that their Maxx C is a 0. This is good against BOTH decks in the meta obviously. My favourite part is that opponent goes Luster PendMagician, then just to have that Pendulum Magician removed and 1 more card ripped away.

3. Replaced Skill Drain with ASF: Both cards are worse than useless against BA, but clearly they are played just to combat the EMEm matchup a bit better. Since I have had multiple games where my EMEm opponents decide to completely ignore Skill Drain and play with pure brute force (and succeed), I think ASF will cover more scenarios where Skill Drain can fall short. With the release of Monkeyboard, the reliance of scale setup has been very high - Monkeyboard has become more important than Joker (don't die to Solemn Notice). Therefore with 3 Notice already mained I decide to go ASF rather than Skill Drain.

4. Mained XYZ Universe: Broken card against BA, how many answers do they have against Ultimatrainer? Maybe a bit weak against EMEm, but at worst it is a Dante + R4 = Infinity / Beatrice.

5. Completely dropped Foolish and Fiend Griefing: Previously my way to deal with BA is to clear the backrows so that I can do shits. However I find this way exceedingly ineffective. We all understand what a trapless BA can do if allowed to play yugioh, and if I still focus on "OK I kill all traps I make setup I can play ygo now", I am actually not in a better position than my opponent, he can play the same amount of yugioh as I can. I changed my plan into "I don't care whether I can play ygo, I just won't let you play", and if something slips past that, I still have Creature Swap.

 

Things that I considered / wanted to do:

 

1. Shaddoll Dragon: If I open a t1 Beatrice, I wanted more ways to deal with EMEm. However, I do not think BA is a deck I wanted to pump over 40. I feel the only dispensable card is G&E, but G&E is much easier to dump than Shaddoll Dragon.

2. Starlight Road: I fail to see how my opponent can answer Starlight Road, but I cannot spare a single spot in my Extra. A Stardust Dragon will often force an EMEm player go something other than Shock, or they will need to deal with Stardust first. You often see EMEm after the pendulum summon go Feral Imp then detach and search Jiga as their extra lv4. With a sudden Stardust they need to Castel first, that means they do not have the luxury of Feral search. If they already have enough lv4 then so be it.

 

 

 

I appreciate any inputs.

 

 

 

Previous versions:

[spoiler]

Visual decklist added later

 

Before everything I think I needed to add intro to these OCG exclusives first

[spoiler]

Beatrice the Eternal Lady

R6 LIGHT Fairy 2500/2800

Can be overlayed onto a Dante monster you control by discarding a BA monster, if summoned this way, cannot activate (1) effect this turn

(1) Once per either player's turn, detach 1 mat to send 1 card from deck to grave

(2) If destroyed by opponent, you can special summon 1 BA monster from Extra ignoring summoning condition

 

Fiendish Rhino Warrior

Lv3 EARTH Fiend 1400/900

(1) Fiend monsters you control (except Fiendish Rhino Warrior) cannot be destroyed

(2) Once per turn if this card is sent to grave, Foolish Burial a fiend monster other than Fiendish Rhino Warrior

[/spoiler]

 

 

Decklist:

[spoiler]

YR60L8.png

Monsters: 22

3 Tour Guide

3 Scarm

3 Cir

3 Graff

1 Cagna

3 Farfa

1 Rubic

2 Fiendish Rhino Warrior

3 Maxx C

 

Spells: 4

1 Galaxy Cyclone

1 Soul Charge

1 Duster

1 Avarice

 

Traps: 14

3 Fiend Griefing

1 Warning

1 Solemn

3 Horn of Heaven (the oldest one)

1 Vanity

2 Fire Lake

3 Breakthrough Skill

 

Extra: 15

1 Dante (Fusion)

1 Virgil

3 Dante (R3)

3 Beatrice

1 No.47 Nightmare Shark

1 Alucard

1 Acid Golem

1 Downerd

1 Consteller Diamond

1 Mermail Gaioabyss

1 DDD Kali Yuga

1 CX Ultimate Trainer

 

Side: 15

2 Galaxy Cyclone

3 Chain Disapperance

3 XYZ Universe

2 Skill Drain

2 Imperial Iron Wall

1 Stygian Dirge

2 Mask of Restrict

[/spoiler]

 

Introduction:

 

OCG meta currently consists of 3 decks: Monarchs, EMEm and  BA. I posted in the OCG Monarch thread that BA is shit when in front of Monarchs, but after some games of Monarch I immediately realized the problem of Monarchs being HORRIBLE bricks. I decided to further look into this deck and gave it a try.

 

Trapless BA does not really work in OCG given there are so many stupid shits in OCG. However, trap BA can run a variety of traps. We are granted more stupid autowins. Whoever plays with no defense either have a lot of those autowins available or just wants to lose.

 

Deck focus:

 

My main deck is built to combat all 3 meta decks. There are cards that do very well in 1 or 2 matchups, but suck against the 3rd matchup. I do not want to play those cards in my main deck since the split of meta is really roughly 1/3 each, and any matchup is not auto-win post-side. It is true that some players would have opted for the way to, say combat BA and EMEm and surrender g1 to Monarchs. No sorry nobody can guarantee you g23 post-side. Monarchs are not Qliphorts where they can still fuck you over and over post side. I feel that a more balanced main deck approach should help me sail further.

 

Main deck:

 

Instead of looking into my deck, I wanted to look into what I will see:

[spoiler]

EMEm: Thing that this deck can throw against you is unlimited. However you will find out that even with one workable trap, you can already stop opponent from killing your Beatrice if they dont have Dweller-like cards. Since my deck has 3 Farfa and a generally higher trap count than the other decks, I am not too concerned about non effect negation. Even Castel is not a threat. Now it comes down to the following monsters: 1 Shock, 2 Dweller and 1 Outer God Azathoth.

Of course Dweller is the most difficult thing to combat, therefore you can see I prepared 3 BTS and 3 Horn of Heaven. I want to make sure they do not fucking resolve a Dweller. Shock can be dealt with Farfa, while Azathoth can be delayed by Farfa. These monsters are a main reason I decide to play full Farfa for my deck very much relies on Farfa to stop Shock and Azathoth - my Breakthrough Skill are saved for Dweller and Pendulum Magician.

 

Monarchs: I split them into two categories: antimeta-Monarch (Majesty mained) and Aither Monarch (Aither mained). If you appreciate that you can Farfa your own Beatrice away, their Majesty Fiend will stand there to be defeated by Beatrice next turn. It conveniently has 2500 atk to run over the lesser Monarchs making it very difficult to deal with. This also means I can save my Horn to deal with Erebus or MegaCaius (if they play it). Again, BTS is very useful against both Majesty and Aither, and a timely Horn of Heaven on Aither is gg.

 

BA: I don't find myself too many chances to play mirror and I would appreciate your input. Currently I decide to just spam a lot of hates in my side deck and hope for the best. Yes this is against that so-called 'focus' but I just have no idea about the mirror.

 

Hates against my deck:

Flying C: I may be a turn slow, but you just gave me a free Horn of Heaven. If I can stand a Rhino, Rubic + C makes you look so stupid. As a contingency, you can also Farfa or Fire Lake it away.

Mega Caius: You will not find me always leaving some Dark BA monsters on the field. If you activate Escalation and summon Mega Caius, I have 3 more BTS for you.

Galaxy Cyclone: I have not seen too much discussion about this card in TCG, but this card is so powerful against BA. There isn't really any counter to this since S/T removal is very difficult to stop. I have considered playing Imperial Custom but feel like the amount of cards it supports is not enough. In something like Qliphort I would happily play Custom but... I will deal with Galaxy Cyclone and accept some losses to this card.

Shadow-Imprisonment Mirror: True this can fuck my deck, but all 3 meta cannot play this Mirror for they have Erebus and Skullcrobat Joker themselves.

Chain Disappearance: While I don't have too many solutions (BoM maybe), I don't care about losing Tour Guide, I don't summon Farfa that often, therefore the only monsters I care are Scarm and Graff. I feel like I can always fall back to Cir + Dante into Beatrice loop even if I get hit by two Chain D, therefore I really don't care.

Compulsory: It is a very cheap answer to Dante and it is at 3. Yet nobody plays it, because it is basically useless against Monarchs and very mediocore against EMEm (Notice I didn't say it is useless, just mediocre). Therefore if someone plays Compulsory it can only be the side. But you only have 3 decks in the meta and Compulsory is good against 1. You really want to play Compuls in your side? I cannot stop you, but there are more serious post-side cards to fuck me over, including the card below.

Stygian Dirge: Good luck

[/spoiler]

 

 

Cards that you may feel weird:

[spoiler]

 

Horn of Heaven:

This is OCG, if you are not playing Compulsory, it means the way to deal with Dante is mostly in monster form, which Horn of Heaven is meant for. It is also great for Pendulum summons for you deal with ALL of them since......

[spoiler]

昇天の黒角笛/Black Horn of Heaven

相手モンスター1体の特殊召喚を無効にし破壊する。

Negate the special summon of ONE monster.

 

昇天の角笛/Horn of Heaven

自分フィールド上に存在するモンスター1体をリリースして発動する。
モンスターの召喚・反転召喚・特殊召喚を無効にし破壊する。

Release one monster:

Negate the summon of monster (didn't say number of monsters!)

[/spoiler]

I admit sometimes I am a try-hard and decide to Horn the Dweller just to deal with 1 less Dweller later. However, having the option to stop the whole pendulum summon makes Horn of Heaven so good. I have also considered the new Horn and I feel that the new Horn is great against EMEm but not Monarchs - they don't care too much about the Battle phase. Ah, I almost always side out Horn in the mirror since it can only stop a Tour Guide or a Dante.

 

Imperial Iron Wall:

Soft counter to opponent hates, but mainly because the Monarch deck cannot have their engine running when Wall is up. Notice this card does nothing against the Monarchs LOL

 

Pilgram:

It is possible that I can walk away unnoticed not having this in the Extra deck if nobody knows that......

[/spoiler]

 

Edit 1:

[spoiler]

9y281u.png

[/spoiler]

 

 

May edit at any time.

[/spoiler]

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Berdversary    181
I would considered a copy of Alich, given how you can't guarantee to draw your defense? The main interaction that comes up is you can chain it to Idea the Heaven Knight and have it negate the incoming Eidos so they are forced to end the turn.

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Doodlebug    613
1 Barbar, Malebranche of the Burning Abyss
3 Cir, Malebranche of the Burning Abyss
2 Farfa, Malebranche of the Burning Abyss
2 Fiend Rhino Warrior
3 Graff, Malebranche of the Burning Abyss
1 Libic, Malebranche of the Burning Abyss
3 Maxx "C"
1 Rubic, Malebranche of the Burning Abyss
3 Scarm, Malebranche of the Burning Abyss
1 Foolish Burial
1 Harpie's Feather Duster
1 Pot of Varice
1 Soul Charge
3 Breakthrough Skill
2 Fiend Griefing
2 Fire Lake of the Burning Abyss
3 Horn of Heaven
3 Skill Drain
1 Solemn Judgment
1 Solemn Warning
1 Vanity's Emptiness
 
1 Dante, Pilgrim of the Burning Abyss
1 Virgil, Rock Star of the Burning Abyss
3 Beatrice, the Eternal Lady
1 D/D/D Founding King Kali Yuga
3 Dante, Traveler of the Burning Abyss
1 Downerd Magician
1 Mechquipped Angineer
2 Number 30: Acid Golem
1 Number 47: Nightmare Shark
1 Stellarknight Constellar Diamond
 
If I lived in Japan and was playing in that particular metagame, I would would play with something like this.  For Monarch hate, I'd have built-in hate in the form of triple Skill Drain.  Of course, they'd also contribute against a handful of EmEm's plays as well.  Asides from using Xyz Universe to potentially summon Beatrice, you can also use it to summon Stellarknight Constellar Diamond when the opponent attempts to do battle with two Dante or Dante and a R3 friend.
 
Barbar and Libic are two cards that I'm not seeing utilized very much in the OCG.  In the late game, Barbar just throws damage around and makes Nightmare Shark a very threatening card.  Libic was the TCG's out to Flying "C", unless we either main deck'd or side deck'd Vanity's and Majesty's Fiend, by allowing us to summon any Burning Abyss monster to Xyz summon Dante, or synchro summon Virgil if we were to put Rubic onto the field.

As for your side deck...  Stygian Dirge and Imperial Iron Wall are the only three cards that don't make a whole lot of sense in my mind.  Stygian Dirge is frustrating for a Burning Abyss player, but it's nothing they can't just Fire Lake and march on as if nothing happened.  As for Imperial Iron Wall, I immediately cannot think of what it would be used against.  Flying "C", for the mean time, should be used in your side deck until Burning Abyss has been around for a longer period of time.  Seeing how a lot of OCG players aren't fully used to the deck yet, it's incredibly irritating when you have a Flying "C" on your field and a hand full of monsters with no real way to use them.
 
#2cents
 
Hope this has been at least helpful to you.
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Locke    2
My first thought when I heard BA was released in ocg was to look for a light machine rank 3 to astral force into nova for cydra infinity. Only found an anime card, but maybe there's some other things available in ocg that I don't know of that could be abused with astral force

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petqwe    286

Thank you for the feedback. I have changed a bit and will update accordingly. I will first reply...

 

- Alich: I do not see what monster I can really negate given its very awkward timing. I may negate a Shock Ruler or an Eidos, but for Eidos they still hold two monsters up on the field, therefore Aither or Escalation still fuck me over. If I don't draw the negations, it probably means I am not playing sufficient negations. I have already decided to main deck Skill Drain for it is only bad in the mirror, and actually it is not that bad: at least Dante cannot get 1500 atk, and Tour Guide becomes a blank.

- Barbar: I have not considered burn being an option for I find that I am losing to two things: Very big monsters (those 2800) and insufficient negations, not to mention I may have Avarice... in fact I actually wanted to try Jar of Avarice. However I understand your point for Nightmare Shark can be a bitch.

- Libic: Sorry this one I don't understand, how is this an answer to C? Do you mean I summon a Rubic and tune it?

 

- Iron Wall: Dropped, I thought it could stop the Monarch drawing engine, but then I was retarded - you can draw or search anything and you cant summon in front of Mask of Restrict! I must be a genius :)

- Stygian Dirge: This card is not for BA... I side it when playing against EMEm...

 

- Flying C: I sincerely don't know whether this card is good or not. It is possible that I still have insufficient experience and limited sample size, because a lot of the time when they Flying C me, I have Horn of Heaven :) True that Flying C can cause trouble to BA, I actually wanted to know how you people deal with it in TCG. Do you just side / main Raiza-esque things?

 

Will update decklist later, currently I am considering:

- LaDD: Against non-BA I do not see any players playing solutions to LaDD. Since the release of this card, a prepared field makes LaDD useless, but an unprepared field means LaDD = autowin. Problem is of course how to summon it, but I do not think having two tributes is too difficult.

- Fog King: Against Monarchs of course. A 2100 Fog King from Downerd is not easy to kill. Does Breakthrough Skill make Fog King "forget" it is advance summoned?

- Masked Change Second: One sided Macro Cosmos, also since all the 3 decks search quite a lot...

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Justin.    735
I'm like 99% sure Horn of Heaven can't negate the summon of Flying "C" since Flying "C" is being summoned via its own effect, not inherently.

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Berdversary    181
While you are correct, Horn of Heaven in this case is using Flying "C" as the tribute to negate a different summon, which would appear to undermine its usefulness vs BA.

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Doodlebug    613

Libic special summons any Burning Abyss monster with its effects negated, meaning it won't care if Flying "C" is on the board or not.  Since it's also level three, you can use it as Xyz material for Dante.  Alternatively, if you summoned Rubic with Libic, then you can just tune with Flying "C" for Virgil.  It's one method that the TCG deals with Flying "C", we also used to use Enemy Controller in the main deck to tribute it that way.  However, some of us main deck Majesty's and Vanity's Fiend and just tribute it.

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SQUIDS~    381

Flying c doesn't seem as much of a problem because of graff and farfa. Also something else notable about alich is its interaction with flying c, so you can use it as an xyz mat.

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petqwe    286
The current meta has shifted a bit - BA are becoming more popular due to its ability to play triple skill drain. With that I don't know whether I care about flying C anymore.

In my games I often find that running over big monsters can be quite difficult - Aither and those occasional Valk can be hard to deal with, not their effects but their natural stats. I wonder whether I need to play cards like dark hole to kill them, especially when I am on the margin of dropping the one Rubic.

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Mr Dragon    312

In response to your big monster issue, I would suggest either Enemy Controller or Future Hope. F0 might be a little difficult to fit in your extra deck though. Enemy Controller does have the second effect as well, which lets you run over monsters by battle Cagna/Cir/Fiendish Rhino as well, which is useful considering how you're normally restricted by both Majesty's Fiend and their Field Spell.

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petqwe    286

This format is almost ending, so I updated this deck!

 

It took me too long to figure out how to play in this stupid ocg meta...

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