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Magician Pendulum - Discussion

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Fullerene60    381

I just went undefeated at toronto 9 round regional with a hybrid or performage and magicians.
Not a single "pure" version made top 8. This deck is just far too linear in its pure form. The only other hybrid in top 4 abused majespecters in the engine.

Some notes:
-Fuck mst, im so happy I dont need to play that card. Dragonpit outs everything that isnt ASF and the performage engine outs anti spell. Id even rather side extra copies of jigabyte.
-Going first was kind of scary vs pepe, getting to kirin was key for that match up. 
-Xiansheng magician turned out to be a cool and usefull combo card, level 4 and scale 8 was fantastic. The stipulation of controlling less cards is usually met due to the use of diamond dire or F0.
-Pendulum call is busted, people were siding all the wrong cards vs pend decks (fairy wind, mst, ghost ogre, typhoon).

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Keba101    14

I just went undefeated at toronto 9 round regional with a hybrid or performage and magicians.
Not a single "pure" version made top 8. In its pure form this deck is just far too linear. The only other hybrid abused majespecters in the engine.

Some notes:
-Fuck mst, im so happy I dont need to play that card. Dragonpit outs everything that isnt ASF and the performage engine outs anti spell. Id even rather side extra copies of jigabyte.
-Going first was kind of scary vs pepe, getting to kirin was key for that match up. 
-Xiansheng magician turned out to be a cool and usefull combo card, level 4 and scale 8 was fantastic. The stipulation of controlling less cards is usually met due to the use of diamond dire or F0.
-Pendulum call is busted, people were siding all the wrong cards vs pend decks (fairy wind, mst, ghost ogre, typhoon).

I love xiangsheng. It outs a lot of problems imo and is just a good card. I think it's undervalued myself.

 

What performage ratios did you play? Or mind sharing a deck list? i'm curious to see.

 

What was your biggest issue aside form ASF? I'm pretty sure thats going to be a fun card in the future.

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Fullerene60    381

Not one floodgate was an issue, dire wolf/castel and dragonpit cover everything outside of ASF+double breakthrough skill or emptiness/kaiser. The only issue I had all day was shaddoll fusion from deck into a shek or the random kozmo otk with a resolved resoning and 2 etele. 

Performage count was actually pretty standard, the engine is nutty good.
I tried taking all the best elements from pepe, clownblade and magicians and just threw them together.
Im keeping the list a secret for a week because I have a cash tourney coming up. 
 

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EddyEd    7

What do you guys think about maining or side decking emergency teleport with a re-cover in order to make Naturia Beast?

 

I think itll viable in this deck because you can make it with dragonpulse magician. It gives you some synchro plays if youd like especially if you put ghost ogre. 

 

Its similar to what qlis did before against nekroz. It obviously would be amazing against any pendulum decks. 

The only outs that i can think of for the main pendulum deck would be a lvl4 spellcastor with anything that can special itself (ex. jigabyte)

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afr    980
Match-up is pretty even. Games are decided on more subtle factors like die roll, wavering eyes and otk potential with opening hands while going second.

The CCG event pretty much showed the same parity between both versions when you put stuff into perspective, however, it actually did show how fucking strong kirin is and how the people with better access to it did better in pendulum mirrors. Also, all PEPE magician decks fell flat by not making it all the way to the finals despite the dominance in top cut, which shows that while they are ultimately a more consistent deck, they are still lacking something.

Magician is a combo based (every card needs another to create synergy) deck while performapals are more value based with more streamlined options and less reliance on combos and the pendulum summon. Both can endure long games and outresource other decks rather easily because both share a lot of pieces, but between them, games are just dumb. I think that performages are more resilient to dumb stuff like mained ASF and with slightly more consistency due to not specifically needing dragonpit to operate and having better standalone monsters while magicians with kirin/odd-eyes have stronger monsters (and with so, better resiliency to kirin), a better extra deck and infinite options with the cards you are dealt (it is not as simple as: do i play castel or wolf first to break that board and what do i follow with?, do i summon dweller?, etc. The odd-eyes deck changes radically every turn and can play in completely twisted and non related ways. For example, let's say you have raccoon, nobledragon and odd-eyes in extra while dragonpit and oaf are in pendulum zone and consider the options; trishula is one option, absolute is another, vortex + kirin + meteorburst is another, totem + absolute could be good aswell, if you play a level 4 majespecter, you geta rank3 and rank4 play, with an extra level 4 monster available in extra, the same set-up could be an OTK with utopia and meteorburst, etc. It is a very very deep deck that can do everything you want it to do), what might kill some people off, is the reliance on the pendulum summon and dragonpit. As a matter of anecdotal experience, i won 2 different locals with my list yesterday and only fell to a critical warning/horn/bth/time-space/tempest once in 14+ rounds of yugioh in a meta full of them (idk if people didn't realize what dragonpit means for their traps or something), which eased my mind a lot on that matter. My losses came to poor hands (3-4 times, don't remember exactly, dragonpit access needs to be adressed) and mst + fairy wind + double destroyer + teleport + pilot after forced to go first (opened really well but still). Didn't lose a match against kozmo and majespecter and against pepe or pepe/magicians i didn't lose every time i saw kirin. I still don't get how people can ignore that card while playing r4 based decks, card is too savage and is a pretty relevant threat; too much resources go away with it.

It is basically 2 sides of the same coin and that is why no one can agree on something and have definite arguments. If monkeyboard and clash come in the SE, i can see clowns being better, but with monkey we are still stuck in the same dilemma as it fixes the scale 8 issue of magicians aswell. I feel pretty confident with this deck as is, until people starts to main deck fragrance.

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afr    980
I really didn't get that comment either as fullehren is a pretty good player, but deck has a large decision tree and extra deck toolbox.

After furthering inspectingvthe CCG Lille event, all of the odd-eyes magician decks in t16 made it to t8, while only 3 out of the 7 pepemagicians deck did it. To me, this shows that not only decks are evenly matched, but that odd-eyes has an edge in mirror and took full advantage of how strong kirin is vs r4 based decks.

The guy won the event with odd-eyes after kirin putting a lot of work, which doesn't surprise me. Odd-eyes stuff adds versatility to what could be a really linear strategy and gives it infinite options and outs against potentially problematics stuff that clowns can only answer with ignister.

With kozmo disappearing from meta (did terrible in most regionals and events tajt took place this weekend), maybe dropping odd-eyes and focus on unciorn and consistency is the better call. Odd-eyes is basically anti kozmo.dek.
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Swartzstrom    4
What I find surprising is that out of the three deck profiles that I watched, none of them were maining Vanity's Emptiness or Solemn Warning. I suppose that makes sense, as Dragonpit is so useful for sniping back row, but those two traps are completely busted right now.

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Fullerene60    381

Kirin is hell to get around.
When it catches on, the hybrid deck I proposed would be a pretty poor choice for an event.

I made the correct choice for the event because nearly everyone in the room was either maining or siding 3 grand horn.
A resolved grand horn usually reulted in a couple free cards for me.

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Takeko    2

Hi I did top 8 at CCG, thanks to afr for his theory that convinced me to play kirin build, I also think that's why I could do so good, I did perfect in rounds (beating the winner who run the same core) and bricked in top 8 (hand was 3 odd-eyes 1 iris, 1 joker and i'm not playing fusion lol ) against this heh... "seraph brilliant pepe magician" who made it to finals.

 

my metacall was a bit off, I was expecting far more kozmo  and ended up not playing against any but I called right that I wouldn't have much kirin build mirror match either. the winner was more prepared to that despite his loss against me. He cleaned my Kirin with a kaiju but unfortunatly he didn't have ressources to get rid of it and I could just use it and profit for game. 

 

I also saw some really original builds like this Naturia Beast Turbo PEPEMagician

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dexer008    805

Is there a link to the builds that top? Also I'm not surprised they dropped warning and vanity, I did a few weeks ago cause as afr pointed out, dragonpit just preys on lone backrow.  What do people think of maining s/t hate in the main? Dragonpit is good but I fear to use him sometimes cause I've had people use his effect against me by setting galaxy cyclones or wavering eyes. Both can be played around but come BOSH there will be fairy pendulum setting 2-3 solemns first turn, in which I believe s/t will be needed alongside dragonpit to help deal the first turn backrow and to be able to play. 

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Swartzstrom    4

Kirin is hell to get around.
When is catches on to most people playing the hybrid I proposed would be a pretty poor choice for an event.

I made the correct choice for the event because nearly everyone in the room was either maining or siding 3 grand horn.
A resolved grand horn usually reulted in a couple free cards for me.


If I'm reading this right, you're saying that you intentionally played into Grand Horn from time to time in order to generate advantage for yourself?

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dexer008    805

 

Kirin is hell to get around.
When is catches on to most people playing the hybrid I proposed would be a pretty poor choice for an event.

I made the correct choice for the event because nearly everyone in the room was either maining or siding 3 grand horn.
A resolved grand horn usually reulted in a couple free cards for me.


If I'm reading this right, you're saying that you intentionally played into Grand Horn from time to time in order to generate advantage for yourself?

 

He played pepe magician, so creating a rank 4 with damage juggler and trick clown usually makes removing the summoned monster moot unless it absolutely had to stick to the field.

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Swartzstrom    4


 

Kirin is hell to get around.
When is catches on to most people playing the hybrid I proposed would be a pretty poor choice for an event.

I made the correct choice for the event because nearly everyone in the room was either maining or siding 3 grand horn.
A resolved grand horn usually reulted in a couple free cards for me.

If I'm reading this right, you're saying that you intentionally played into Grand Horn from time to time in order to generate advantage for yourself?
 
He played pepe magician, so creating a rank 4 with damage juggler and trick clown usually makes removing the summoned monster moot unless it absolutely had to stick to the field.

That's what I was thinking. Just wanted to be certain. Thank you for the clarification. I'm still learning about proper deck building and technical play in this game.

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Eruntien    43

Kirin is hell to get around.
When it catches on, the hybrid deck I proposed would be a pretty poor choice for an event.

I made the correct choice for the event because nearly everyone in the room was either maining or siding 3 grand horn.
A resolved grand horn usually reulted in a couple free cards for me.

 

Sorry I am slightly confused on what you are saying. So you believe hybrids will be bad if Kirin becomes populuar?

 

Any good outs you can think of?

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muzzy    92
If your R4 gets Grand Horn'd with a Trick Clown you don't get it's effect since you are forced to skip the phase and "miss the timing" for the clown effect
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wduartes    75

If your R4 gets Grand Horn'd with a Trick Clown you don't get it's effect since you are forced to skip the phase and "miss the timing" for the clown effect

who told you that? I think that isnt acurate.

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knives1990    262
Wasn't something similar brought up for Dante + materials being hit by Grand Horn? I believe the answer was summon negated, opponent draws then ends phase, BA effects resolve immediately in whichever phase it now is.

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Abe Thalos    518

I've tested a bunch of different mixed builds, but cant seem to find one that could survive going first 50% of games at a 9 round event.

However, I'm pretty sure that the pure build makes vortex consistently enough to survive going 1st and that makes it the overall better, yet underrepresented, deck.

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afr    980

Is there a link to the builds that top? Also I'm not surprised they dropped warning and vanity, I did a few weeks ago cause as afr pointed out, dragonpit just preys on lone backrow.  What do people think of maining s/t hate in the main? Dragonpit is good but I fear to use him sometimes cause I've had people use his effect against me by setting galaxy cyclones or wavering eyes. Both can be played around but come BOSH there will be fairy pendulum setting 2-3 solemns first turn, in which I believe s/t will be needed alongside dragonpit to help deal the first turn backrow and to be able to play. 

Forget about BOSH for now, tbh i don't think that deck as is will make it and the builds will radically change anyway.

I found that mst/fairy wind did more damage to me than horns, colosseums and trap holes. People is not so smart, but we could use that to our advantage for the time being. I expected a lot of kozmo on saturday and that is why i went with eccentrick, card put in serious work ajd mst would have been pretty much the same except one time i opened poorly and made trish with both eccentricks to keep me in the game.

An mst in mirror to bait dragonpit could be super powerful now that most people still expects warning. The problem with mst in theory, is that they could use oafdragon to bait it or have that clutch iris. I think that ogre is much better for that lone purpose but leaves holes for people maining anti spell.

I used antispell when going first in non pepe pendulum mirrors and someone used arrows on me, and while i still won, because i had oaf and joker to beat, the card still seemed powerful enough to me.

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Keba101    14

So anybody's thoughts on running dracoslayer in the build for ignister access? I mean we already run 6 level 4s for engine purposes anyways. Or did anybody not find room? also should i be running 2 or 3 kirins? I can' seem to find a happy medium. I don't want to give up the dracoslayers because ignister has just outright won me so many games.. especially against walzmos

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The Ween    237
I recommend you read the article Matt wrote about deck building that is now in the article section. It makes answering the question of how many copies of a card you should play much simpler- in this case the number of Kirins depends on how many cards you are playing before you put it in, and you should keep in mind that you are playing 3 extra copies because of wavering eyes. I would still personally back 3 copies because of its sheer power but you should draw your own conclusions.

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dexer008    805

I recommend you read the article Matt wrote about deck building that is now in the article section. It makes answering the question of how many copies of a card you should play much simpler- in this case the number of Kirins depends on how many cards you are playing before you put it in, and you should keep in mind that you are playing 3 extra copies because of wavering eyes. I would still personally back 3 copies because of its sheer power but you should draw your own conclusions.

This. Be warned though it is a VERY. LONG. READ. I had to dedicate half a hr to it and lots of attention since his articles are basically written like a college textbook. 

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