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Axle    1215

Whether this deck does well in TCG is really variable. The current meta needs to be nuked down to size. It can't really beat some of the decks. BA is probably the only good match-up because Kirin.

 

If Kirin gets limited/banned this deck is also screwed and I'll probably shelve it. 

In testing it does really well against Blue-Eyes and ABC. Going against Monarchs is suffering and Kozmos is really dependant on drawing Gofu. Dracopals feels like the better Pendulum deck too so that will have to get hit for this deck to be meta.

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Sanjura    6725

if someone else wants to use my OP and spruce it up with pictures, that would be a great start to getting this posted in Deck Discussion. 

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Me.    1347
56 minutes ago, Axle said:

Whether this deck does well in TCG is really variable. The current meta needs to be nuked down to size. It can't really beat some of the decks. BA is probably the only good match-up because Kirin.

 

If Kirin gets limited/banned this deck is also screwed and I'll probably shelve it. 

In testing it does really well against Blue-Eyes and ABC. Going against Monarchs is suffering and Kozmos is really dependant on drawing Gofu. Dracopals feels like the better Pendulum deck too so that will have to get hit for this deck to be meta.

What do you do going 2nd against spirit dragon?

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Sanjura    6725
17 minutes ago, Me. said:

What do you do going 2nd against spirit dragon?

gofu+any lv3 pendulum monster is ignister and their only defense vs that is moonlight, but at that point you just pendushit 5 and go in.

if you're able to make orihulk, you can pop it with a scale and force the tribute; your cards can be gotten back thanks to combination.

 

g2-3 there's kaijus, and so on. 

 

spirit really just puts a damper on pendulum in general,though.

 

 

edit: there is no way Metalfoes has a good Blue-Eyes match especially when there's a floodgate that's a part of their deck and also having the ability to banish scales at will while bypassing counter at the same time

 

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Axle    1215

Gofu/Eccentrick are maxed and will force Azure/whatever out. Some builds run Speedroids. Otherwise you can Pend a single Kirin to force it out then setup a couple Metalfoes Counter for a defense during their turn so Metalfoes can live to see their turn again. If you drew Raccoon instead of Kirin, all the better to stop them from making a board with any non-Azure'd dragons. 

You'd need a shitty hand of all Metalfoes to not be able to beat a Spirit setup and not be able to set a bunch of Counters to keep you alive next turn.  (Post INOV a crappy hand of 5+ Metalfoes can do this too though). 

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Me.    1347

maybe I'm just overestimating blue-eyes ability to hit back on their turn, because the only real out seemed to be drawing gofu. Azure-eyes is still a problem probably, and making orihulk to pop with a scale probably means fusing with materials from the hand. The fusing summons going absolutely nothing against blue-eyes really doesn't help either.

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Axle    1215

I've only gone against Blue-Eyes around 5 times and they all weren't great players. I'd have to test more for sure to see what goes on in action. ABC I know is good though, you can disrupt their normal summons pretty easy. That's not for awhile however and closer to us getting INOV. In INOV, Subterrors might enter the meta too and create another unknown variable. 

 

Perhaps I was going first a lot more than I thought and that was why the BE match-up felt really good. I'll try going 2nd more often against them in testing. 

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+Satchmo+    3201
1 hour ago, Sanjura said:

if someone else wants to use my OP and spruce it up with pictures, that would be a great start to getting this posted in Deck Discussion. 

I'll do it, I just need to write some notes for it

 

low-key though, Cockadoodledoo is 4/5/6 Gofu in terms of breaking boards like spirit, multiple backrow etc. It just requires different level metalfoes than gofu. E-tele also helps get you to multiple monsters for Gofu/Cock/etc, and that card just gets better in November with the lv1 guy.

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Odin_21    9

So I also tested the deck a little bit, because imo this deck has the potential to be one of the bewt decks here in the tcg. But Im not really sure yet how to build the deck, so maybe we can discuss that: Sp when it comes down to deck building I think 12 Metalfoes are no question. Then I think I would play 3 decision/3 art, because you want to get your engine going and satchmo made that calculation that the chances of opening 2 metalfoes are 13% higher comparing 15 vs 18. Also you want to trigger gofu turn 1 and therefore 18 are also important. Coming to the spell/trap ratio, I think 1 fusion is also standard, because you always have access to it, thanks to the recycling eff and often you only summon 1 fusion per turn, in some cases 2 but you never summon 3 imo, so 1 fusion is perfect. Both traps are pretty similar, if we assume you trigger 1 metalfoe turn 1 and you set counter/combination in turn 2 counter is the better card without a doubt, because it can protect you from beeing otked, combination is pretty much useless in turn 2. If we are in turn 3 we also need to look at some situations to compare the cards. 1st it could happen that we only have 1 metalfoe monster and we want to fuse before ps in that scenario both traps to litteraly the same, we can pop either a face up monster or a scale to trigger counter and summonijg 1 additional monster to fuse then, if we have a combination set, we can pop combiantikn to search 1 metalfoe and the fuse. Each card has also one additional advantage with counter set, the advantage is that you can just normal the 1 metalfoe that you already have and that way you can fuse both from field, wich givew you more monsters in the extra to ps. The disadvantage is, that if you pop 1 of your scales to trigger counter, you need to have another one, if you want to pop 1 monster from your field, you need one, so we assume that your opponent couldnt break your board. The advantage of combination is, that you dont have these conditions, you can just pop combination and search the metalfoe, the disadvantage is, that you have to fuse from your hand. The other bonus is, that you can also trigger this eff turn 1 via ecc or speedroids (if you play the engine) wich is also great. The 2nd eff from counter is only good if you already used coubter turn 2 to protect you, but since you can use counter on the last attack, you can the activate the 2nd eff turn 3, add the metalfoe from the extra deck ns it and then fuse with it. Combinations 2nd eff is also ok, but the disadvantage is, that you need setup to use the eff. You have to have 2 metalfoes already, but them the eff is also good cuz it gives you more free monsters. However I think counter is the better trap, the card serves multiple roles and its more flexible then coimbination. So Inwoudk decide to play 1 fusion/2 counter/1 combination. Then we have the main core with 22 cards. Because this deck is good at offense, but not at defense you need some defensive cards, not only to protect you, like counter, but some cards to interruppt the opponent, so I think playing 3 Bunbukus/3 Kirin is good, because kirin is also a low scale in some cases and it makes your turn 1 better. Then I also think 3 Gofus are good in this deck, for obv reasons. Then I also think 3 ecc are essential because the card is really flexible, it can out monsters/backrows/trigger combination. Then I have 6 spots left and there Im really not sure what engines I should play:

a) -2-3 Ariadne/ 4 Counter traps

b) -1 Scout/1 Monolith, 3 Terrortop/1 Taketomborg

c) -1 Luster/3 Master/1 Lector/1 Face off

d) -3 Terrortop/1 Taketomborg, 2 random traps

e)  -1 Scout/ 1 Monlith, 4 random traps

f) -2-3 cupiditys, Speedroids, Qlis/traps

I think a makes your turn 1 really really good, because this deck can trigger ariadne easily twice and none of the current meta decks can summon 3 times per turn. The downside with the ariadne engine is, that it takes your options if you go 2nd. Then its only good if you can make a big field with 1 card less and supoort it with your counter traps, wich means game then. But I have to test it. Because if I talk with friends about the deck, some say that the turn 1 with ariadne is just to weak and can be beaten easily, because crystal wing/kirin alone arent that good, so I think engine a is the best for now.

Engine b is more flexible because infinty is also good going 2nd and speedroids with break sword and grampulse. Going 1st both engines are also great cuz of infinty/totembird and ghe ability to go into void ogre with speedroids and gofu.

I dont tested option c yet, but in theory I dont think its really card, to open 38 turn 1 you need either luster + lv 4 + pendulum monster or luster/master + pendulum monster + possibility to go into hulk wich is not often the case. I also think dinoster is not really needed because you already losd up your extra deck with the fusion, so I dont think playing slayers is good.

I also not like option d and e because I think traps that you have to draw are not that good. Because if you play traps then its better you search them instead of hoping to draw them if you can establish a strong field. But maybe its also ok, because you not have to fill 6-7 spotd with ariadne and instead you can play a variable engine like speedroids and 2 traps to fill up the last slots.

I havent thought about cupidty yet, so I cant write my opinion to that card. But Im intrestibg what do you think about the last 6 spots and also if you would play something else in the 1st 34, even though I think there kinds standard besides summoners art, 3rd ecc, 3rd decision.

 

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Axle    1215

Playing Pot of Desires(cupidity) is better than maxing Painful Decision. It improves your draws far better. 2 Desires is minimum, but 3 is worth it for sure. 

One thing to note about Summoner and how this deck works...Yes it boosts your odds of having proper scales but you also want to be playing enough non-MF power cards (especially pre-inov) or else you just brick. The deck is shit if it doesn't draw Kirin/Gofu/whatever, so it's best to make sure you have enough of those before you think about going 3 decision/3 Summoners Art. Therefore if you're going the Summoner's Route, 1 Scout/1 Monolith is pretty much mandatory to make your Summoners also pull a power card..otherwise just cut the Summoners all together. 

 

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foofatron    37
On 7/26/2016 at 5:00 PM, Sanjura said:

if you're able to make orihulk, you can pop it with a scale and force the tribute; your cards can be gotten back thanks to combination.

Spirit can just negate this grave effect though. Already mentioned that you'd likely have no follow up play too.

 

Also, I feel that if blue-eyes decides to build to go first they'd run veilers. They can run up to six thanks to sage and with all their draw cards that gives them good odds of seeing it, which would counter monster outs.

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Axle    1215

Yeah I admit I wasn't really thinking and used too much of my little personal experience rather than actual logic.

The matchup can't be -that- bad though, since Metalfoes are the more successful deck in OCG and both decks are basically the same here and there (new Metalfoes fusions wouldn't make that much a difference against BE I think?). Using results as logic is terrible reasoning and I don't mean that as an answer, but yeah just saying BE probably doesn't single handedly force this deck out of the meta or anything. 

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Odin_21    9
17 hours ago, Axle said:

Playing Pot of Desires(cupidity) is better than maxing Painful Decision. It improves your draws far better. 2 Desires is minimum, but 3 is worth it for sure. 

One thing to note about Summoner and how this deck works...Yes it boosts your odds of having proper scales but you also want to be playing enough non-MF power cards (especially pre-inov) or else you just brick. The deck is shit if it doesn't draw Kirin/Gofu/whatever, so it's best to make sure you have enough of those before you think about going 3 decision/3 Summoners Art. Therefore if you're going the Summoner's Route, 1 Scout/1 Monolith is pretty much mandatory to make your Summoners also pull a power card..otherwise just cut the Summoners all together. 

 

Yes I agree, I think pot is good in this deck because you can just set your important ressources and activate it then. For your non engine cards you have enoug, so it isnt that hard if some of them get banished I think. I also agree that the engine is bad, the only reason why this deck could be good is, that it is the best pendulum engine if pepe get hit and due to to good scales and the ability to abuse cards like gofu and kirin in the deck. But because of that you also need some engine cards, to make the non engine cards good, but like you said I think a number of 14 metalfoes is also good.

What are your thoughts about the trap ratio and what do you think are the best non engine cards that you would play in this deck?

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14 hours ago, Axle said:

Yeah I admit I wasn't really thinking and used too much of my little personal experience rather than actual logic.

The matchup can't be -that- bad though, since Metalfoes are the more successful deck in OCG and both decks are basically the same here and there (new Metalfoes fusions wouldn't make that much a difference against BE I think?). Using results as logic is terrible reasoning and I don't mean that as an answer, but yeah just saying BE probably doesn't single handedly force this deck out of the meta or anything. 

This is false. OCG metalfoes have 2 very significant differences to TCG.

1. Super Poly is legal, making it a field wiper when used with Cardinal and Adamante.

2. Cyber-Stein is legal. Access to Naturia Exterio or The Last Warrior From Another Planet makes many opposing players start foaming at the mouth. Especially since the scales can then pop the Stein to reduce the otk risk.

 

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Axle    1215

They don't even play Cyber Stein anymore

And they side deck Super Poly

 

so nope you're wrong

 ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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AlMacuby    97

OCG Metalfoes also doesn't have to deal with Kozmo. Kozmo naturally have a very good matchup vs Pendulum decks, since they run Strikes, don't suffer that much agaisnt Kirin and Sliprider becomes a reactive trap.

This deck works like Magicians: Your main engine is good for scales and can push out damage, that's it. Both decks have inherent ways to provide scales for the next turn (Pendulum Call, Iris, Oaf and Odd-Eyes to refill your Hand vs Counter and Combination). However Metalfoes lack core-removal: You have to rely on unsearchable cards like Eccentrick and MST/Cyclone to play around backrow, the Metalfoes themselves can't deal with a set Strike. Magicians have Dragonpit Magicians and many ways to get to him, which gives the deck longevity and the ability to even play the game. Also the Magician engine can search defensive monsters on their own: Xiangke Magician, Clear Wing (with Nobledragon), Vortex Dragon (with Mammoth or OE Fusion) can be summoned if you open a hand of 5  Magician/Peformapal/Sky Iris-Cards. The only defense this deck can provide in those situations is literally blocking damage with bodies and more bodies through Metalfoes Counter. The Fullmetalfoe Alchemist serves a vital role in this deck: Not outright lose if you open 4-5 Metalfoe cards.

If you look at Metalfoes vs Magicians in a vacuum, Magicians surely appears to be the better engine (especially if Joker and Wisdom-Eye were still at 3), the power of this deck comes from the side bitches you are able to bring with you.

 

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11 minutes ago, Axle said:

They don't even play Cyber Stein anymore

And they side deck Super Poly

 

so nope you're wrong

 ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

Lastest YGOrg decklists has 37 Metalfoe decks. Out of those I counted around 9-10 that used Stein. That is not an insignificant percentage.

Regarding the similarity of this deck to Pendulum Magician, it's true. But Metalfoe's advantages are several.

You are more consistent in getting pops since there are more copies of Metalfoe scales and Painful Decision/Summoner's art than there can exist copies of Sky Iris and Terraforming. So you can more effectively run cards like Ariadne/countertraps, Scout/Monolith/CDI, and stuff like Vortex Trooper.

The scales themselves can set up recovery. Magician's problem has always been that if you got rid of their scales en masse they had trouble re-establishing them without Sky Iris. The Metalfoes scales searching out Counter and Combination make it much easier to rebuild scales if they get Twin Twistered or otherwise destroyed.

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Axle    1215

Yeah. I understand that Stein was still seeing some play. I was just referencing that those 2 cards were likely not the deciding factors in the BE match-up. Of course getting a first turn WTFA-Planet would be sweet, this problem would still be going 2nd against Blue-Eyes, especially if they can search veiler for Stein. If no veiler you can summon a Gaia Drake to run over their Spirit/Azure/MoonlightBRD but that's it. 

Yeah Metalfoes have Gofu too which is nice. Like said before, they have better applications for the "side bitches" cards over Magicians, but the main engine is a bit weaker until INOV.  I can see why Magicians might be stronger at the moment. Pendulum Call is a good card and OCG had it limited for some weird reason.

 

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Titcombe    58

I think a legit consideration for this deck going forward would be to build it for going second. Without Ariadne, I've found the deck pre-alkahest can't really make strong turn 1 fields as even opening tzolkin is outable vs most decks, you really need both kirin and tzolkin and considering the possibility of that I'm not really sure if going first is worth it. You could play ariadne but ariadne is one of those cards which are just outright terrible going second and dedicating so many slots for an engine which isn't good going second hasn't been great for me so far. Building for going second means the chances of opening about 3 metalfoes goes up and it's not like this deck can't out opening fields; Blue-eyes want to go second anyway so in a future format where the current meta decks are weakened with blue-eyes being one of the stronger contenders I think focusing the deck on having the most playable 6-card opening hands might be better. As others have brought up though at the moment this deck just can't compete with monarchs or kozmo or regular pendulum so it's just a matter of waiting for the banlist :/ Sorry for rambling post.

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Axle    1215

If Blue-eyes is the best deck in the coming meta then I'd definitely be maining 2 Jowgen. Card is great against them whether you go first or second. 

 

 

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Me.    1347
Just now, Axle said:

If Blue-eyes is the best deck in the coming meta then I'd definitely be maining 2 Jowgen. Card is great against them whether you go first or second. 

 

 

So why not 3 jowgen?

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Axle    1215

Too cloggy against other match-ups. It only has 1300 defense, something that most decks can beat. If it was nearly tier 0, sure. Of course if you can setup Kirin + Jowgen turn 1 then it doesn't matter. Between 2 Jowgen, 3 Gofu and 3 Pot of Desires, I think you'll be able to draw enough {actually good} T2 outs to Spirit, but I'll have to check. 


It's a pretty good out to a DD too though, so maybe. Clear the board then pop it with a scale, etc. We'll just have to see how the meta shapes up. 

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M.C.B.    173

I noticed that going second has major benefits in some matchups as well. More because of the card they didn't get than anything else. That is why I dropped Ariadne despite its beautiful synergy with metal engine. I replaced counter traps with Trap holes instead. I try to build in the direction of getting out Rafflesia, going first or second (alongside Gofu into Beelze plays). Bottomless trap hole is a powerful play against BE. Going second also justifies Ogre as hand trap further. Having tuners to go with the LV5 fusions (which I do just to get to draw 1 card from the graveyard effect most of the time) is nice. 

Extra deck space is TIGHT!!!

I would need 25 to fit all ranks!

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AlMacuby    97

If you play to go 2nd and main deck Ghost Ogre because it is good in the format (which might or might not be the case), I would also highly advice playing 2 E-Tele to give you additional way to prepare your Pendulum summon agaisnt backrow. Tele on Ogre allows Rank 3 and Synchro plays.

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M.C.B.    173
3 minutes ago, AlMacuby said:

If you play to go 2nd and main deck Ghost Ogre because it is good in the format (which might or might not be the case), I would also highly advice playing 2 E-Tele to give you additional way to prepare your Pendulum summon agaisnt backrow. Tele on Ogre allows Rank 3 and Synchro plays.

goes without saying,

I like it to make the fusion live before pendulum summon as well, go for rank 3 before pendulum or use the lv3 for fusion before pendulum

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