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Bagasem

Is family an illusion?

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Bagasem    2

I just don't see how I'm socially obligated towards a person just because we came out of the same body at some point. I see that as superficial. For example, I was expected to attend the wedding of my mother's cousin's daughter, and the only reason I went was because I was "doing as the Romans do".

I lived in the US for school for about 5.5 years, only attending events that I found appealing and complying with my morals, but, now that I am back in the Middle East (specifically Kuwait), I have been following the norm and attending family functions left and right, and it feels like torture many times. I'll give myself a couple of years here to work and observe what life in this country has to offer. If it's not for me, I'm taking off.

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»ACP    33376

Great first post. Welcome to DGz.

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markus    2069

>admin deletes the thread I decided to actually post in

>when I press Submit Reply to send the post thread is gone

>I have to type up my reply all over again.

>lazy version of reply instead of in depth thoughts because I feel like I wasted my time.

 

No, family is not an illusion, it just doesn't really matter.

 

It's ultimately your choice whether or not you care for a person. Them being related to you doesn't really matter. If someone's nice to you you can like them, if someone's terrible to you, you can not like them. This should apply to all people, including family. Them being family shouldn't change anything. You're probably really young right now and being forced to attend these gatherings but when you get older, unless you already are old enough, you can decide whether or not these gatherings, or these people are worth you time. If you value the care your family has given you throughout your life I would consider partaking in events with them. I mean the least you could do is actually be apart of your family, but if you've been given a rough upbringing, like a lot of people I know, it's fine to just not be apart of the family as they made your life a living hell. Really it doesn't matter at all, at least in my opinion.

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markus    2069

You being in Kuwait, I expect that it's a very religiously driven country, being in the middle east and all. Religion and family are strongly valued and are considered to be mandatory to respect in certain areas of the world, but it's not really mandatory you don't have to do it. You can just not care and not be apart of those things. I don't think it would be legal for them to harm you or something if you didn't participate.

 

I know Kuwait is more relaxed than Saudi about these things, so you're /probably okay/ if you just don't care and don't participate, but really family usually cares a lot about you, but you don't have to be there to show that you care. They should know that you care.

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markus    2069

Also, I have a friend in Kuwait. If I recall correctly you can't have sex unless you're married or something, and there are many other weird laws like that. I don't believe countries reserve the right to enforce those types of laws on their people, so I'm just going to tell you if you like freedom and so on not to live in Kuwait because there's going to be a lot more annoying things than having to attend family gatherings. Move back to the United States or some other country that you're fine with. Middle Eastern countries are horrifying.

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mark    3104

I'm only going to respond to the question in the title.

I feel like this is a very subjective question. For some, family is the only thing that matters, and it makes sense to feel that way, and I respect that, and I can understand why: because if you've known each other for so long, have invested in each other for so long, and kind of have this unwritten rule that you won't leave each other because you're blood, then you can just blindly trust each other, I guess that's why people always say 'friends come and go, family will always be there'. 

That said, it's kind of a weird way to look at the world, and it doesn't make a bunch of sense when you have this mindset that family is important 'because it's family'. I mean think about it: everyone is someone's family, and I assume that you wouldn't want to be family to 'any person in the world'. So it would be a pretty stupid to objectively state that everyone should find their family important, (I'm talking about family as in blood, not family as in your wife and children, because that's your own decision and that's definitely always important imo), because that gives your family members a free card to do whatever, then expect you to still be there for them. I don't like that kind of idea, I also don't like the idea of having to live up to the expectations of my parents/older family members, because it's up to me to decide what I want to do with my life. That said, I know a lot of friends of mine who have a very open-minded and supportive family, and I know people that were abused and left alone, and for them family is something evil, which is understandable as well. 

I feel like I'm personally somewhere in between: I've broken contact with my mother for over a year now, I don't go to any family meetings she attends, and I don't answer her calls. When my sister asked me to have christmas diner with my mother, my grandmother and her, I had to say no: Although I'll have christmas diner the day after with her and our father and his wife. I live on my own by the way, to clear things up. Now some people blame me for having broken contact, and sometimes I do feel bad about it, because it's always being portrait-ed like I'm the bad guy. But at the same time, I feel like I'm a very loyal and honest person, I currently still have best friends that I've known for 8+ years, so at some point you can wonder what someone will have to do for me to be done with them. I always used to say that I'm one of the few people who can have a 10 min conversation with my mother without it resulting into a fight, and it used to be true - she has fights with everyone, due to her mental illnesses and she doesn't want to take any help/medication, she also doesn't change no matter what you try and she'll take any chance to manipulate you and use your weaknesses against you. Now she's not a bad person, but she doesn't know any better and she just can't help it. But I got to move on with my life, I can't have her in my life without becoming too negatively affected by her, no matter how many boundaries I set and what I tell myself: she's still my mother so she knows how to trigger me. She's probably the only person in the world that can get me real angry or emotional just by saying words: and she knows that. The worst part about family is when you change, when you want to do things with your life, and they just won't accept it and still expect you to be the kid you used to be, and do as they say. I value my freedom, so I'll break contact with anyone who's actively trying to suppress me over a period of time, because I just can't deal with that. I won't change my mind anyway, it'll only be a unnecessary struggle, and I don't see the point in that. 

So no, I don't think family is an illusion, as in that it holds no value. But it can be an imprisonment as well, and I think that at some point you just get to 'break free'. It's up to your family really to either accept the path you've chosen, or if they don't, then it's up to you whether or not you'll keep in touch. I don't buy this 'we don't support you but we still want you to do exactly what we say because we're family and you're supposed to' mentality, because if they actually supported you, then you probably wanted to see them anyway. If you don't want to see your family, I'm going to assume you have a good reason for it, and if they want to know they'll ask you for the reason. It's up to you to decide how important family is for you, as you're the person who knows them, and you're the one who has to deal with the consequences. But I'll give you this much, it's hard to find friends that you can trust like family, and it'll take several years and hard effort before reaching such a level, and even then there's no guarantee they'll be forever anyway: but family stays family, they're the ones who will always be there, or at least when things go like they're supposed to. 

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Bazoo    5678

I have real connections with all of my family members. We have gone through multiple important experiences together and I have fond memories of each. Especially Cousin Nicky, Hamurai, Mrs. Refrigerator, Mr. Beuragard, Reverse Giraffe, and Mr. Poopybutthole.

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website is bad    2169

if family is an illusion how come white people say fam all the time

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+mmf    23356

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mark    3104
2 hours ago, mmf said:

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As a scepticist I'm somewhat on the 'everything is an illusion' camp, because most beliefs people hold are actually false, my own included, although I don't turn that into 'Which means nothing matters/nihilism', because things can have value without being 'sure' 'true' or 'real'. Such as people believing in god can be restful and make them live good or give them hope without god actually existing, also I don't ever know for sure if my food isn't being poisoned but I'm still going to eat it, etc. 

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»Tygo    14094

I treat family as I would any other person I know/meet. I have family that I drink, talk deep with and/or talk regularly to, play video games, and everything else you could do with anyone on the planet if you so choose..... and I have family that won't respect my opinion on politics because "I'm only 28 yrs old." Choose to include people who matter to you in your life if you can. If you're forced to put an effort, go as minimal as you can without it becoming a hassle for you and move on with your life. 

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+mmf    23356
On 12/18/2016 at 5:52 PM, mmf said:

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Dank Memeston    1716

Your issue shouldn't be whether or not family is an illusion. Your issue should be whether or not you care for or are attached to any of the family you have now. 

 

If family is an illusion then this has many other heavy applications while if you ruminate on whether or not you love the people in your family then you will find a stronger will to cut it off. 

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Mascis    4418

dank memeston with the serious reply to this thread

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website is bad    2169

the greatest meme of all is posting earnestly unironically.

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+greasy thug    18941
On 2016-12-18 at 6:18 AM, Bagasem said:

I just don't see how I'm socially obligated towards a person just because we came out of the same body at some point. I see that as superficial. For example, I was expected to attend the wedding of my mother's cousin's daughter, and the only reason I went was because I was "doing as the Romans do".

I lived in the US for school for about 5.5 years, only attending events that I found appealing and complying with my morals, but, now that I am back in the Middle East (specifically Kuwait), I have been following the norm and attending family functions left and right, and it feels like torture many times. I'll give myself a couple of years here to work and observe what life in this country has to offer. If it's not for me, I'm taking off.

 

This would depend on your upbringing.  Usually if you value your family it's because you went through a combination of positive and negative experiences that ultimately proved to be beneficial to you.  By definition family entails a stronger bond between people much more than your best friend so if you don't feel that way, move on.  Also answering your question, family is not an illusion.  It's actually real

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buckwheatloaf    205

He undertook, he tells us in his essay on Brotherly Affection, the office, whilst he was in Rome, of arbitrating between two brothers, one whom was considered to be a lover of philosophy. “But he had,” he says, “in reality, no legitimate title to the name either of brother or of philosopher. When I told him I should expect from him the behaviour of a philosopher towards one, who was, first of all, an ordinary person making no such profession, and, in the second place, a brother, as for the first point, replied he, it may be well enough, but I don’t attach any great importance to the fact of two people having come from the same pair of bodies;” an impious piece of freethinking which met, of course, with Plutarch’s indignant rebuke and reprobation.

 

ppl were getting made fun of for saying this 2k years ago haha

 

 

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