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Audioslayne

Iron Fist

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Anyone else watching this despite the negative reviews?  I'm a bit of a Marvel fanboy so take my analysis with a grain of salt.

 

I'm only halfway through it at this point but I'm generally enjoying it.  It's certainly Netflix's least strong Marvel title so far but its certainly enjoyable.  The acting is fine even if the writing could use improvement.  The action scenes are also decent, and I feel like Danny is actually portrayed pretty damn close to how he is in the comics.

 

The main ailment the show seems to suffer from is it's villain does not get built up well or quickly enough to be engaging.  All heroes need a good villain and without proper conflict it's hard to get attached.  That being said I feel like Danny was already going to be a hard sell since his general laid back light hearted manner doesn't fit well into the gritty world Luke Cage and Daredevil have set up for the Netflix marvel scene.  

 

They could have easily went a different direction with him but since they're mostly introducing him to work towards defenders they're trying so hard to make him converge.  There's a reason we usually see Luke and Danny paired.  They play well off of each other and provide balance, forcing one into the others role was just never going to be great.

 

Then there's the fact that he is very Batman-esc in his origin which doesn't help him feel like anything new or exciting.

 

Can anyone who has finished it weigh in?

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3 hours ago, Audioslayne said:

Anyone else watching this despite the negative reviews?  I'm a bit of a Marvel fanboy so take my analysis with a grain of salt.

 

I'm only halfway through it at this point but I'm generally enjoying it.  It's certainly Netflix's least strong Marvel title so far but its certainly enjoyable.  The acting is fine even if the writing could use improvement.  The action scenes are also decent, and I feel like Danny is actually portrayed pretty damn close to how he is in the comics.

 

The main ailment the show seems to suffer from is it's villain does not get built up well or quickly enough to be engaging.  All heroes need a good villain and without proper conflict it's hard to get attached.  That being said I feel like Danny was already going to be a hard sell since his general laid back light hearted manner doesn't fit well into the gritty world Luke Cage and Daredevil have set up for the Netflix marvel scene.  

 

They could have easily went a different direction with him but since they're mostly introducing him to work towards defenders they're trying so hard to make him converge.  There's a reason we usually see Luke and Danny paired.  They play well off of each other and provide balance, forcing one into the others role was just never going to be great.

 

Then there's the fact that he is very Batman-esc in his origin which doesn't help him feel like anything new or exciting.

 

Can anyone who has finished it weigh in?

Yeah I finished it. It's about even with Luke Cage for me. Cage was probably definitely excelled in a cultural element and was probably a bit more enjoyable, but Iron Fist probably had a stronger plot (which isn't saying much)

 

None of the characters are particularly compelling (Joy and Ward are basically useless and lack any strong drive really). And all of the villains (like in Luke Cage) are underdeveloped and cast the wayside way too quickly. Danny being so lighthearted while the writers simultaneously try to give him some moral conflict/angst is really done terribly. 

 

Tbh, it kind reminds me of Arrow in that you were more interested in the Danny's past storyline than the main one and it seems like they are setting up a season 2 to show more of that. 

 

 

 

 

 

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I don't like Jones one bit and I'm not sure if it's his fault but the fight choreography dropped leagues below the rest. 

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First half of the series was decent.

 

Second half was awful.

 

Still better than Luke Cage, but only just. (the ONLY saving grace for luke cage was cottonmouth).

 

Like I know what they were TRYING to do with the hand but the execution was dreadful

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Every other series had a theme too and this one missed that Mark even though it was right in their face. 

 

Daredevil - classic legal (law and order etc)

Jessica Jones - classic PI (dick Tracy etc)

Luke Cage - classic blaction hero (shaft Mr t etc)

Iron Fist - really could've been ten times more of a call back to Xiao lin style for movies like crouching tiger. 

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Posted (edited)

Honestly I'd prefer if they decided to forgo making a season 2 of this and Luke Cage in favour of a Heroes For Hire series. It'd probably work better. 

Edited by Mr Dragon
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all their boring non mask lives have too much screentime on all these shows.   ironfist trying to be mad men. that hand storyline

 

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Wasn't as bad as the reviews made it out to be, but I understand a lot of the criticism in this thread.

 

Personally I felt like Danny was the least interesting character for the entirety of the show and only really got real development during the last 3rd of the season. Wasn't really displeased with anything else, I wasn't look for super great story telling from a super hero show.

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On 3/21/2017 at 9:30 PM, Tygo said:

I don't like Jones one bit and I'm not sure if it's his fault but the fight choreography dropped leagues below the rest. 

I have to disagree. Jones did the best job of weaving together the underlying theme with the storyline imo. The villain really embodied and accentuated the undertones of the series and pretty much carried the show. And the pure darkness of the series was great espeically in how the managed to keep the suspension of disbelief by grounding it in reality 

On 3/22/2017 at 3:14 PM, Winter Multi said:

First half of the series was decent.

 

Second half was awful.

 

Still better than Luke Cage, but only just. (the ONLY saving grace for luke cage was cottonmouth).

 

Like I know what they were TRYING to do with the hand but the execution was dreadful

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Luke Cage had a lot of potential, but the villains personally just ruined it for me. Too cheesy personally. Really wish they took some creative liberties to make the story a bit more realistic. The underlying themes gave it so much potential as did the cultural aspect. 

 

The hand thing is also really sad because Iron Fist is the series that dealt with them the most extensively. 

14 hours ago, Satchmo said:

Wasn't as bad as the reviews made it out to be, but I understand a lot of the criticism in this thread.

 

Personally I felt like Danny was the least interesting character for the entirety of the show and only really got real development during the last 3rd of the season. Wasn't really displeased with anything else, I wasn't look for super great story telling from a super hero show.

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I think you're wrong not to look for great story telling. Both Luke Cage and Iron Fist could have been done much better and Netflix has shown they can do much better than this with Daredevil and Jessica Jones. 

 

 

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Posted (edited)

Worst Marvel show yet. Even Luke Cage had its highs for the 2nd half, whereas IF was just middling to just outright bad for the entire season. No compelling villain either, while the other shows all had that.

 

I did enjoy Colleen though, and wouldn't mind seeing a spinoff with her in it. Hated Danny. (Should've been Lewis Tan, the drunken fist guy in a later episode) Hated Ward, Harold, and Joy, namely their storylines which are boring whenever it took up screentime. And those fight scenes... Yeesh.

Edited by Telvin123
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my nigga danny channel his chi to his dick and fucked collien with the iron dick

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5 hours ago, Telvin123 said:

Worst Marvel show yet. Even Luke Cage had its highs for the 2nd half, whereas IF was just middling to just outright bad for the entire season. No compelling villain either, while the other shows all had that.

 

I did enjoy Colleen though, and wouldn't mind seeing a spinoff with her in it. Hated Danny. (Should've been Lewis Tan, the drunken fist guy in a later episode) Hated Ward, Harold, and Joy, namely their storylines which are boring whenever it took up screentime. And those fight scenes... Yeesh.

Who was the compelling villain in Luke Cage? 

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Posted (edited)

5 hours ago, Francis J Underwood said:

Who was the compelling villain in Luke Cage? 

 

Cottonmouth.

 

While Black Mariah had initial potential... until she didn't. Shades was also cool for what he was. Diamondback was complete shit though. (Yet I unfortunately still found him more enjoyable than what IF gave us.)

Edited by Telvin123
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6 minutes ago, Telvin123 said:

 

Cottonmouth.

 

While Black Mariah had initial potential... until she didn't. Shades was also cool for what he was. Diamondback was complete shit though. (Yet I unfortunately still found him more enjoyable than what IF gave us.)

Eh I didn't feel like Cottonmouth was that compelling. Plus they killed off way too quickly. Didn't really get to make an impact

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Eh... Shades was my favourite villain character from that show. It was sort of funny how he was just some regular criminal guy who constantly had to put up with everyone around him doing crazy shit and being wannabe super-villains. So that was fun to watch. Cottonmouth was cool but they killed him off far too early. 

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I actually think Luke Cage is tied for second with JJ, it was really well done.

 

As for IF, its probably the weakest out of the 4 shows but not as bad as the reviews made it seem to be. Most characters lacked in this series (Ward's had potential only if they couldve made him interesting) and the fighting was subpar. The ending was very unsatisfying and it seemed they were trying to do too much with too little. Lacked focus and theme conpared to the other series.

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Gao uses super powers to blow IF into a wall once but never uses them to get away from bakuto, someone she was actually afraid of.

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On 3/24/2017 at 0:52 AM, Francis J Underwood said:

I think you're wrong not to look for great story telling. Both Luke Cage and Iron Fist could have been done much better and Netflix has shown they can do much better than this with Daredevil and Jessica Jones. 

I hadn't seen JJ at the time of that post (but I did finish it that day) so my only experience with it was Luke Cage and the actual movies in the franchise. I still haven't seen Daredevil tbh, but I will try to get to it soon.

 

But based on the second half of Luke Cage and and the bigger films, I was used to seeing average shit. That's not to knock anyone who wants great story telling from the MCU, I want that too, I just have come to not expect them to take as many risks up until I finished JJ. In a similar Vein, I thought the action in Iron Fist was fine until I watch an actual Martial Arts movie again, and realized that Iron Fist's action only works because a majority of audiences don't know actual martial arts. Although I greatly appreciate the lack of editing in the action scenes.

On 3/24/2017 at 1:04 AM, Telvin123 said:

I did enjoy Colleen though, and wouldn't mind seeing a spinoff with her in it. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daughters_of_the_Dragon

 

They set up Misty in Luke Cage, they had this planned from the start :eevee:

17 hours ago, Tygo said:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

maybe she didn't feel the need to run from bokuto

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I'm hip, they better put her in a show with Misty ASAP lol

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Cottonmouth was a great villain. Powerful unpredictable and woth a brilliant actor. Often i found myself just skipping to his scenes. When he died, Luke cage went from mediocre to bad.

 

I liked the first few eps of IF but it just got so shit so fast

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come on guys no one can seriously think this is even remotely decent

 

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On 3/26/2017 at 4:40 PM, Winter Multi said:

Cottonmouth was a great villain. Powerful unpredictable and woth a brilliant actor. Often i found myself just skipping to his scenes. When he died, Luke cage went from mediocre to bad.

 

I liked the first few eps of IF but it just got so shit so fast

The acting and writing for him were pretty good, but the concept of him as a villain is just so off putting and he got killed off before they could really develop his character. 

 

I agree it got worse after Cotton Mouth died. 

On 4/3/2017 at 9:00 AM, Malcolm said:

come on guys no one can seriously think this is even remotely decent

 

Concept wise it had potential, but yeah it was a let down pretty much in all aspects. 

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Posted (edited)

Having watched nearly all of this now and my opinion of the second half of the show has made me think it's slightly better than I thought it was - it's not incredibly dull anymore, it's just sorta badly written. It's as if they had like 22 episodes worth of material and instead of cutting out the extraneous crap they decided to just cram everything in then remove everything in between that would give the narrative any flow or consequence

Like early on they spend 3 episodes trying to show Danny working to get people to believe his identity and him trying to get his company back, then they just drop all of that on his lap in the 4th episode almost completely out of nowhere. This type of thing happens so often that I'm beginning to believe that the real reason for this being delayed for a year is because of scripting problems. Outside of that and the action being the show is fine I guess, but obviously those are two big issues.

One thing that I can recommend about this show though is that it has one random hilarious dark comedy scene in it (and I'm perfectly willing to admit the comedy is possibly unintentional) Spoilers below for episode 9:

 

 

 

 

Edited by Mr Dragon
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