ACP

PSA: Zoodiac is still retarded in the new format

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While people on youtube are busy parading around their meme-tastic Zoodiac combos involving all sort of nonsense like brilliant fusion and predaplants, I've been trying to figure out more realistic and standard Zoodiac combos on my own that aren't stopped by literally every hand trap and actual trap in the format that have the potential to quickly swing a game. I will admit that probably a lot of people have "already figured all of this out" and will comment "haha you're an idiot if you didn't already know this", but in the absence of any reliable resources whatsoever dedicated towards the competitive playerbase, I thought I'd lay this all out so that as a full community we can remain on the cutting-edge of competitive, current play.

 

Standard Ratpier Combo

 

Any Ratpier (and hence Tenki) can lead to some pretty strong boards. Although we're not going to drawing 10+ cards turn1 anymore, we can still put ourselves significantly far ahead on t1, to the point that I highly suspect that people will still be complaining about the die roll has having too much influence on the outcome of a match.

 

Hand: Raptier

1. Normal summon Ratpier, send Ramram to the grave.

2. Overlay Ratpier for Boarbow, detatch Ratpier, special summon Ratpier from hand or deck.

3. Overlay Boarbow for Broadbull, detatch Boarbow, search any Zoodiac monster of your choice (usually Whiptail).

4. Overlay Broadbull for Chakanine, detatch Broadbull, special summon Ramram from the grave.

5. Overlay Chakanine into Hammerkong, Tigermortor, and then Drident (3 materials).

6. Detatch a material from Drident, kill your Ramram, special summon Ratpier from the grave.

7. Overlay the two Ratpiers for the rank 4 of your choice, usually Daigusto Emerald or Tornado Dragon (note that before detatching for Daigusto Emerald, we will have exactly 3 monsters in the graveyard).

 

The end result is that by expending one card in hand as our normal summon for the turn we end with a Whiptail in hand, a Drident in play with 2 materials going into the opponent's turn, and a rank 4 of our choice in play. Although card advantage bears little relevance in modern-day Yugioh, this is a +2. It's worthy of note that Ash Blossom will not fully interrupt our combo, although it will stop us from making the rank 4 at the end. No big deal. Ghost Ogre, however, if used correctly (on our Ratpier's effect to send Ramram) will fully interrupt our combo.

 

Other Pure Combos

 

What if we don't have Ratpier? It depends, but usually we can set up some pretty similar combos depending on the rest of our hand. It's still very difficult to completely brick if your deck is well-constructed.

 

Hand: Zoodiac Barrage (no other Zoodiac cards in hand)

1. Activate Barrage, kill itself, special summon Ramram from the deck.

2. Overlay Ramram for Broadbull, detatch Ramram to add Ratpier to your hand.

3. Normal summon Ratpier, use effect to send whatever you'd like (Zoodiac Combo or Whiptail usually)

4. Overlay Ratpier for Boarbow, detatch Ratpier, special summon Ratpier from the deck.

5. Overlay Boarbow for Chakanine, detatch Boarbow, special summon Ramram from the grave.

6. Overlay Boarbow for Tigermortor, swap Boarbow for Whiptail (if you sent Whiptail in step #3), then overlay for Hammerkong and Drident (3 materials).

7. Detatch a material from Drident, kill Ramra, special Ratpier from the grave.

8. Overlay the two Ratpiers for the rank 4 of your choice.

 

Here, we see a pretty similar result, except instead of netting a Broadbull search (we had to normal summon it), we end with a extra Xyz monster in play (the Broadbull). Not bad.

 

Hand: Any Zoodiac monster (not Ratpier) + Barrage

1. Normal summon Zoodiac monster (henceforth referred to as ZM), overlay for Broadbull, detatch ZM, search Raptier.

2. Overlay Broadbull for Chakanine, detatch Broadbull, special summon ZM from the grave.

3. Activate Barrage, kill ZM, special summon Thoroughblade from the deck.

4. Use Thoroughblade's effect, discard Ratpier, draw 1.

5. Overlay Chakanine for Tigermortor, swap Chakanine for Ratpier.

6. Detatch Ratpier, special summon Ratpier from the deck.

7. Overlay Ratpier+Thoroughblade for a rank 4 of your choice.

8. Overlay Tigermortor into Hammerkong into Drident (2 materials).

 

This is a strong opening, as we have converted 2 cards and a normal summon into a Drident, rank 4 of our choice, plus an Barrage on board which our opponent has to deal with before our next turn, and a draw from Thoroughblade. This is, again, roughly a +2.

 

In the event that you open Ratpier+Barrage (with no other combo pieces) usually you're just going to want to go for the standard Ratpier combo, which Barrage providing added insurance in the event that your Ratpier gets hit by Ghost Ogre. There's no way convert the Barrage into an extra rank 4.

 

Multiple diagustos t1? In my format? It's more likely than you think

 

There was substantial debate about whether or not Zoodiac decks were better with or without the Draco engine in them. Now, I think there will be very little debate regarding this matter. The Draco engine is the best way to extend our standard Ratpier or Barrage combos into an ending boards that are nearly unbeatable. Diagram in particular is insane because it can destroy Ramrams in our hand and trigger them.

 

Hand: Ratpier+Diagram+Master Peace or Draco Spell

1. Normal summon Ratpier, send Ramram to the grave (sending Ramram here is just in case we get our Diagram Ash Blossom'd later in the combo).

2. Overlay Ratpier for Boarbow, detatch Raptier to special summon Ratpier from the deck.

3. Overlay Boarbow for Broadbull, detatch Boarbow, add a 2nd copy of Ramram to hand.

4. Activate Diagram, kill your in-hand Ramram, search Master Peace/Draco Spell (whichever piece you're missing)

5. Ramram's effect is triggered and special summons Ratpier from the grave.

5. Overlay Broadbull from Chakanine, detatch Broadbull to special summon Ramram from the grave.

6. Overlay Ratpier x2 for Daigusto Emeral, detatch Ratpier, and shuffle back Ratpier, Boarbow, and Broadbull to draw a card

7. Activate Draco Spell, use effect to tribute Draco Spell and Daigusto Emeral for Master Peace.

8. Overlay Chakanine for Tigermortor, swap Chakanine for Ratpier.

9. Detatch Ratpier, special summon Ratpier from the deck.

10. Overlay Tigermortor for Hammerkong then Drident (2 materials).

11. Use Master Peace or Drident (your choice) to kill Ramram, special summoning Ratpier from the grave.

12. Overlay Ratpier x2 for Daigusto Emeral (or a different rank 4 if you prefer).

 

Our end result is that we turned 3 cards in hand into Master Peace, Drident, and rank 4 of our choice, and 1 draw. Given how much redundancy the deck can play (5 Ratpiers, 6 Diagrams, 6 Draco Spells, 3 Master Peace) you are actually quite likely to open this combo. Many times, you might not have the full combo, but draw into the other pieces as you are comboing off. It's more likely than you think. In addition, Barrage typically works here in place of Ratpier as well, although the lines play out slightly differently. In some cases, I have even made 3 Daigusto Emerals t1 with Ratpier in hand+Barrage+multiple diagrams. The most nutted hands in this deck actually resemble the Fusion Substitute combos of old pretty well.

 

Of course, one of the other advantages of running the Draco engine is that we can replace our Terrortops with Baobaboons, giving us access to M-X-Saber Invoker, which is still pretty insane.

 

Sample Hands

 

I won't give out the entire decklist yet, but most of it is pretty straightforward. The deck builds itself for the most part. Next, I'll provide with 3 randomly-generated sample hands, and how I'd play them going 1st vs an unknown deck.

 

Hand #1: True Draco Heritage, Master Peace the True Dracoslaying King, Zoodiac Barrage, True Draco Apocalypse.

Pre-Combo comments: The interesting thing about this hand is how Draco pieces that we've opened. We can actually end up using Diagram to search a 2nd Master Peace and play them both, one immune to monsters/spells and the other immune to monsters/traps. This is incredibly difficult to beat.

1. Activate Barrage, use effect to kill itself, search Ratpier.

2. Overlay Ratpier for Boarbow, detatch Ratpier to special summon Ratpier from the deck.

3. Overlay Boarbow for Broadbull, detatch Boarbow to search Ramram

4. Activate Dragonic Diagram, kill Ramram in hand to search Master Peace.

5. Ramram is triggered and special summons Ratpier from the grave.

6. Overlay Broadbull for Chakanine, detatch Broadbull to special summon Ramram.

7. Set True Draco Apocalypse. Normal summon Master Peace by tributing the set trap and Ramram.

8. Overlay both Ratpiers for Daigusto Emeral, detatch Ratpier, shuffle back Ratpier, Boarbow, and Broadbull to draw a card (it's Ratpier).

9. Activate True Draco Heritage, draw a card (it's Baobaboon).

10. Use True Draco Heritage's effect for an additional tribute summon. Tribute Daigusto Emeral and Heritage for a 2nd Master Peace.

11. Overlay Chakanine for Tigermortor, swap Chakanine for Ramram.

12. Overlay Tigermortor for Hammerkong and then Drident (3 materials).

 

End result: Master Peace in play (monster/spell immune), Master Peace in play (monster/trap immune), Drident in play (with 3 materials, 2000 defense, and targetting trap immune), 3 continuous spells/traps in our graveyard, Diagram in play, Ratpier+Baobaboon in hand (pretty bad draws to be completely honest).

 

Hand #2: True King's Return, True Draco Heritage, Zoodiac Whiptail, Ghost Ogre & Snow Rabbit, Terraforming

Pre-Combo Comments: This is another interesting hand, because it might seem like we have no Ratpier access. In this case, we won't need it at all to end with a strong board.

1. Terraforming for Dragonic Diagram.

2. Normal summon Whiptail, overlay for Broadbull, detatch Whiptail to search Ramram.

3. Activate Diagram, kill Ramram, search Master Peace.

4. Ramram is triggered and special summons Whiptail from the grave.

5. Overlay Broadbull for Chakanine, detatch Broadbull to special summon Ramram.

6. Activate True Draco Heritage, use the effect to tribute summon Master Peace by tributing Ramram and True Draco Heritage.

7. Overlay Chakanine for Tigermortor, swap Chakanine for Ramram

8. Overlay for Hammerkong, then Drident (3 materials).

 

End result: Master Peace in play (monster/spell immune), Drident in play (with 3 materials, 2000 defense, and targetting trap immune), Whiptail in play (which can attach itself to Drident if we desire), Diagram in play, True-King's Return set, 1 continuous spell/trap in grave, Ghost Ogre in hand).

 

Hand #2.5: (Virtually the same as hand #2, so I just shuffled in and drew again)

 

Hand #3: True King's Return, Zoodiac Barrage, Ghost Ogre & Snow Rabbit, True Draco Heritage, Baobaboon

1. Normal summon Baobaboon, use effect to draw into Disciples of the True Draco Phoenix. I decide to bottom True King's Return

2. Activate Zoodiac Barrage, kill Baobaboon, and get Ratpier.

3. Special summon 2 Baobaboons trigger both, draw into True Draco Apocalypse (we bottom it), and Dragonic Diagram, (bottom Ghost Ogre).

4. Overlay Ratpier for Boarbow, detatch Ratpier, special summon Ratpier from deck.

5. Boarbow for Broadbull, detatch Boarbow, search for Ramram.

6. Activate Diagram, kill Ramram, search Master Peace.

7. Ramram is triggered and special summons Ratpier from the grave.

8. Overlay Baobaboon x2 for M-X-Saber Invoker.

19. Overlay Ratpier x2 for Diagusto Emeral, detatch Raptier, shuffle back Ratpier, Boarbow, Baobaboon to draw 1 (it's another True Draco Heritage).

11. Activate Heritage, use effect for an extra tribute summon, tribute Heritage and Daigusto Emeral for Master Peace.

12. Overlay Broadbull for Tigermortor, swap Chakanine with Ratpier.

13. Detatch Ratpier, special summon Ratpier from the deck.

14. Activate M-X-Saber Invoker, detatch Baobaboon, special summon Whiptail from the deck.

15. Overlay Ratpier and Whiptail for Daigusto Emeral, detatch Ratpier, shuffle back Ratpier x2, Emeral to draw 1, (it's another Diagram).

16. Activate the 2nd copy of True Draco Heritage from our hand, draw 1 card (it's Whiptail)

17. Play the 2nd Diagram, kill M-X-Saber Invoker to search Master Peace.

18. Overlay Tigermortor for Chakanine, detatch Tigermortor to special summon Ramram from grave.

19. Activate Disciples of the True Draco Phoenix, use effect to tribute Ramram and True Draco Heritage for Master Peace #2.

20. Chakanine for Hammerkong and then Drident

 

End Result: 2x Master Peace (both immune to monsters/spells), Drident with 2 materials, Emeral, Diagram, Barrage, 2 continuous spell/traps in grave, with Whiptail+Ghost Ogre in hand.

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Can we ban Daigusto Emeral now?

 

With my limited experience playing against Zoo, seeing Zoo play and skimming the OP, I feel Daigusto is one of the main problem cards in Zoo.

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the ocg uses 0 emeral in their zoodiac true draco decks, and they also have effectively 0 raptier, 0 drident, 0 barrage.

 

Ban the entire fucking archetype.

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The thing about banning emeral is that it becomes irrelevant in about 4 months or w/e link summons drop. Zoodiacs are still nuts without emeral, but emeral isn't broken with zoodiacs with link summon mechanics as far as I can tell.

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If they want to get rid of it just ban Broadbull and Drident tbh. Would there be any unfair things they could do even with Norden? Like making a rank 4 or drawing 1-2 cards is pretty fair, I think the advantage comes from Broadbull and Drident being infinite +1's per turn. 

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I like how these retarded cards do shitton of things, generate as much advantage and still couldn't get past a Master P.

 

And then imagine if you COMBINE Draco and Zoodiac and call it a deck.

 

I wonder whether you guys enjoy playing against Draco Zoodiac or Felidar Guardian.

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On 5/25/2017 at 5:51 PM, Gemstone Mine said:

The thing about banning emeral is that it becomes irrelevant in about 4 months or w/e link summons drop. Zoodiacs are still nuts without emeral, but emeral isn't broken with zoodiacs with link summon mechanics as far as I can tell.

Quick prefix- this has nothing to do with Zoodiac per-se, I'm just bitching about Emeral being literally degenerate, but:


Emeral is a card that always finds itself into infinite or powerful loops- even before the norden combos came out, the most powerful part of resolving ratpier was that you put back 2 rats so that you could just do all that bull shit a second time (and subsequently recycle emerals as well for infinite resources), with the additional point of pressuring them to play thought Drident + Emeral with the Drident pop, because either monster left on board is a threat on the follow-up.

 

But even outside of that, Emeral continues to weasel it's way into powerful combos and infinite loops, pretty much since it's inception. We can go back to 2012, where Allen himself showcased a Six Samurai infinite hand/burn/draw loop which of course, uses 2 Emeral. Beyond that, you can look at most loops, infinite or otherwise, coming back to this card. And even when it's not looping/comboing, it's used to extend resources for players far into grind. An example of this was back in 2015 when people shifted to playing multiple Emeral in Nekroz. Emeral is literally a better version of Pot of Avarice, and Pot of Avarice is a very, very good card. This isn't something stopped by link format, on the contrary most infinite loops or degenerate combos post links swing back into involving emeral- just as well using emeral's other effect to revive Gaia Video Guy Link Monster to make multiple Link 4s easier aside from draw loops. An immediate practical example is the Star Grail deck, which uses a free emeral to extend combos with Agent of Creation Venus further and draw into cards similar to how zoo does with the Fusion Sub loops (obvious Zoo is a better deck).

Tl;DR- as long as emeral exists it's just gonna keep directly enabling degenerate shit, it's a ridiculously strong card.

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 This shit right here is why Yugioh  has become so awful. 

 YOU NEED TO LITERALLY DRAW ONE FUCKING CARD TO COMBO OFF and jerk off for 5 minutes.

 

 ugh.

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I think Emeral isn't the worst card design ever. The real problem imo are all of these engines that allow you to put free rank4s into play. If they weren't spamming Emerals, they'd just be spamming something else. Seeing as I don't think we plan on banning literally every good rank4 ever, it seems more logical to address these problems at their source.

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emeral is honestly like mass driver. It's never the problem inherently, it's almost always the result of something else being broken, but it encourages that broken thing to new heights, and it's probably better just to ban it prempetively.

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How do you kill Zoo though? Looking at the OCG, even hitting Rat, Drident and Barrage isn't enough. Do we have to nuke the entire archtype?

 

The True Draco portion is easy. Master Peace to 0 (it's probably the most oppressive and meta warping boss monster printed yet) and Terraforming to 1 (Field Spells have just gotten too good in general lately for this card to be at 3. Field Spells are going to get even better if current trends permit). You can debatably put Diagram to 1 too, but with 0 Peace, would it even be worth it? Like, I can't see True Draco/King being good without Peace.

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2 hours ago, ACP said:

I think Emeral isn't the worst card design ever. The real problem imo are all of these engines that allow you to put free rank4s into play. If they weren't spamming Emerals, they'd just be spamming something else. Seeing as I don't think we plan on banning literally every good rank4 ever, it seems more logical to address these problems at their source.

that unfortunately in modern yugioh, will apply to everything thing. You see something similar with Psyframe-Lord Omega  and recently Link decks and Firewall Dragon as some easy examples. The issue with attacking engines is that ban one set of broken engines just replaces it with another and that continues down until the game is slowed to something more akin to formats from prior to Phantom Darkness. Assuming we stop all future engines from being able to spam multiple extra deck mons to the board. I'm not gonna say that's a worse way to handle things, however it doesn't the way Konami wants to do things, and it bloats the banlist (something they seem to not want).

 

So because permanently banning every powerful deck isn't exactly feasible I just advocate for all the shit that allows you to FTK as a constant to die- shit like Emeral, Fusion Gate etc. Which is ironic because a lot of these cards end up being completely fair or outright bad in a vacuum but swing around to allowing degenerate shit to n conjunction with multiple different groups of cards that are powerful.

2 hours ago, Nate1080 said:

How do you kill Zoo though? Looking at the OCG, even hitting Rat, Drident and Barrage isn't enough. Do we have to nuke the entire archtype?

I think Mark is on the right track of Bull + Drident. Quite honestly I think Emeral theorectical ban would just phase the deck out eventually as new decks come out over subsequent sets, but an immediate hit to those 2 would probably do it as well.

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even without emeral, just because you can't do the apeshit combos doesn't mean that it doesn't see play for the foreseeable future as an engine splashed in other decks (like ocg true draco zoodiac) if you don't hit the core, especially ratpier (like plants saw for years until they finally axed gub). I think you limit ratpier, ban drident + bull, ban emeral, and then take barrage if the rest of the core is still a problem later.

 

2 hours ago, Nate1080 said:

Like, I can't see True Draco/King being good without Peace.

 

dinosaur true king uses 0 master peace, but that deck isn't exactly the pillar of consistency even with 3 terraforming and 3 diagram, so master peace to 1 and diagram to one should put both decks down I think.

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I don't think its worth putting down Dinos, in the context of current YGO the True King stuff is pretty tame. The deck loses to itself, if not because of a brick hand it would be because it runs out of steam fairly quickly, in addition to their best monsters not being as good as other deck's best monsters.

 

 

Hell, after Master Peace, the True Draco stuff is just a more modern Monarch deck that isn't too oppressive by itself (unless I am missing something). Which is why I believe Master to 0 and Terra to 1 to be enough to control True Draco (and even KingDinos. Terra to 1 would hurt a lot).

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tbh I think the main problems with dino are going 2nd if opp draw +5/6 because you don't have room for infinite hand traps and ways to deal with drident

 

and hand traps (on diagram, mainly)

 

deck is insanely consistent outside of this tbh, like literally almost every hand you draw is combo 

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and tbh just play zoodiac dino for consistency as well I think

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2 hours ago, Satchmo said:

that unfortunately in modern yugioh, will apply to everything thing. You see something similar with Psyframe-Lord Omega  and recently Link decks and Firewall Dragon as some easy examples. The issue with attacking engines is that ban one set of broken engines just replaces it with another and that continues down until the game is slowed to something more akin to formats from prior to Phantom Darkness. Assuming we stop all future engines from being able to spam multiple extra deck mons to the board. I'm not gonna say that's a worse way to handle things, however it doesn't the way Konami wants to do things, and it bloats the banlist (something they seem to not want).

 

So because permanently banning every powerful deck isn't exactly feasible I just advocate for all the shit that allows you to FTK as a constant to die- shit like Emeral, Fusion Gate etc. Which is ironic because a lot of these cards end up being completely fair or outright bad in a vacuum but swing around to allowing degenerate shit to n conjunction with multiple different groups of cards that are powerful.

I think Mark is on the right track of Bull + Drident. Quite honestly I think Emeral theorectical ban would just phase the deck out eventually as new decks come out over subsequent sets, but an immediate hit to those 2 would probably do it as well.

This kind of point doesn't make any sense. We're talking about the way that things should be, not what will actually happen. This is why 99% of the time banlist discussions are so stupid, because someone proposes a rational solution, then someone inevitably responds with, "But Konami would never do that!"

 

Saying "Emeral should be banned, assuming that we're not allowed to ban any of the engines that make Emeral good" is self-evident and is not meaningful discourse in any kind of discussion regarding the best way to balance the game.

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About Zoodiac:

Quote

Many years ago when Synchro monsters were introduced, nobody thought things would go out of control in such short amount of time. Since 2008 Yugioh has mostly been played with an Extra deck instead of a main deck. Your main deck is just for spamming numerous smaller monsters to turn them into bigger monsters.

 

Then when XYZ monsters were released, the idea was 'to turn some smaller shitty monsters into bigger monsters'. Originally this idea is fine but:

1) Aren't we doing this thing already with Synchro monsters? We are just spamming tuners and non-tuners and turn them into white monsters?

2) When the smaller monsters aren't shitty at all, either with too powerful effects or those monsters are just free, you just end your turn with 5 monsters

3) When the bigger monsters are overpowered as fuck. Shock Ruler anyone?

 

The extra deck was still OK-ish after the list split - game has changed. Instead of summoning tonnes of monsters in one go and win from there, you now summon less monsters but with a backup mechanic that allow you to do the same things next turn.

 

Then Konami decides needing TWO monsters to perform an XYZ summon is too many. Lets change the requirement to only ONE! So you summon ONE Rat, XYZ summon as many times you like and end with 2 powerful monsters on the field. No, banning / limiting Rat does not solve the problem: just look at OCG we are still ending our turn with two monsters while expending only 1 normal summon.

 

The WHOLE concept of Zoodiac is just stupid. When the first set came out, there were 5 lv4 monsters and 4 XYZ monsters. You know this means we perform 4+ XYZ summons per turn. Then two more XYZ monsters were printed and this just changed to 6+ XYZ summons.

 

I do not know whether Konami planned to fix shits when they introduce the link mechanics. These years our spam is mainly limited to how many materials we can bring onto the field. However, under the new mechanics, unless you are playing links, you now have one more limitation of not being able to summon multiple bigger monsters. Currently, this 'big monsters' limitation is harsher than the 'small monsters' limitation, but you know Konami keeps printing new cards and one day stupidly overpowered link monsters are sure to arrive. By then the limitation shifts back to materials, and the format goes nuts again.

 

 

About Emeral:

Quote

Lavalval Chain is 'just' a Foolish Burial. Look at how many stupid things we can do with 'just' a Foolish Burial.

 

Emeral is not different. You just shuffle Emeral and two other monsters to your deck and repeat shits. Hell even if it only shuffles 3 cards to deck without drawing, people will still use this card to loop things.

 

We have seen too many combos requiring a Emeral. None of those combos are viable without Emeral. If a one-off Pot of Avarice is still banned, why is a recyclable walking Avarice that does not require you to draw into still unlimited?

 

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4 hours ago, ACP said:

This kind of point doesn't make any sense. We're talking about the way that things should be, not what will actually happen. This is why 99% of the time banlist discussions are so stupid, because someone proposes a rational solution, then someone inevitably responds with, "But Konami would never do that!"

 

Saying "Emeral should be banned, assuming that we're not allowed to ban any of the engines that make Emeral good" is self-evident and is not meaningful discourse in any kind of discussion regarding the best way to balance the game.

You're 100% right, in the context of banlist discussion, that is an issue with it. But when we get into "how things should be ideally" as opposed to "how things should be within the context of the current direction of the game", we need to clearly define a set of ideals and then shape the card pool around that. And everyone has a different ideal of how they want yugioh to be, so while overarching issues will be unanimously solved, it's not gonna be clear cut in some finer design aspects.

 

But I'm not saying "let's make a fair format where Emeral isn't abused", I'm saying "Emeral is being abused and will continue to be unless they deal with Emeral", and the alternative of changing the entire card pool to be a different form of yugioh is a separate conversation all together.

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10 hours ago, Nate1080 said:

I don't think its worth putting down Dinos, in the context of current YGO the True King stuff is pretty tame. The deck loses to itself, if not because of a brick hand it would be because it runs out of steam fairly quickly, in addition to their best monsters not being as good as other deck's best monsters.

 

 

Hell, after Master Peace, the True Draco stuff is just a more modern Monarch deck that isn't too oppressive by itself (unless I am missing something). Which is why I believe Master to 0 and Terra to 1 to be enough to control True Draco (and even KingDinos. Terra to 1 would hurt a lot).

 

They can't hit Terraforming, too many decks that rely on their field spells as key engines, like every other theme they release these days relies on a field spell to work. Terraforming to 1 and basically all that shit just crashes and burns. Of course it's a bandaid solution to flawed card design, but at this point hitting Terraforming would cause way too much collateral damage for a card that isn't really an issue in itself as much as Konami's tendency to make field spells too powerful.

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Terraforming to 1 now is still 1 more field spell in a deck than before Set Rotation was printed. 

 

I don't think powerful field spells are necessarily an issue with the game at all. Aside from enabling ignorant cards, like Master Peace, I think its actually great that field spells are becoming more important in archetype design with cards like Terraforming and Set Rotation existing. I think generic searchers (ROTA, Tenki, Terraforming, etc) are good for the game and shouldn't ever be the cards considered with limiting or banning. I'd rather play with, and against, decks with comparatively higher consistency and lower power (or even higher power) than vice versa.

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I think Terraforming to 1 is fine.

 

In the past, people played 2/1 or 3/2 ratios of Field Spells to Terraforming.

 

It's moreso now that we play 3/3 and have stuff like Snow in Grass ABC to make use of extra copies. Or have Draconic Diagram be able to pop dead Terraformings.

 

If Konami really wanted to, they'd make a Gravekeeper's Commandant or Warrior of Atlantis for that new theme.

 

Madolche Butlerusk is another design path, and decks that don't have a Normal Summon can use Planet Pathfinder.

 

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>list talk

AAAAH AFTER TEN THOUSAND YEARS, I'M FREE

1115423-powerranger2486.jpg

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.................(___)..........
.................|Oo|...........
.......... /```` OO).........
........./ |____-- .......emeral is fine, l2p
.......*...L......L.............

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Another thing about Zoodiacs is they as 1 card XYZ get around the restrictions placed on Cattle Call:

 

300?cb=20160506080718

 

It's kind of remarkable that now you can turn any Beast Warrior into a disposable Zoodiac XYZ, stack Broadbull, get its search, and then end in Drident, completely making up for the -1.

 

I mean what the heck?

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