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Laval - Discussion

September 2011 Format Lavals

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170 replies to this topic

#81
The Pale King

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Ben's right about Tephra being unwieldy, tho I can see the justification for running a copy as a power trap. One of the few games I lost on DN with this deck was to a Kristya-protected field that I couldn't break, so Tephra would have uniquely helped there.

I think that if you play Tephra (at any number), you have to have a clear strategy for when/how to use it. For example, it's probably best employed to back up an already established field of something like TGHL/Stardust/etc. In that case, losing your Graveyard isn't so bad since you've already gone off once, and clearing away your opponent's cards, and protecting your own, likely means game next turn. All other times, tho, I sort of cringe if I activate it, unless I can follow it up with Return (a staple in Tephra builds) for game, or Cannon -> Lancelord for floater beatdown with the possibility of more RFG recursion to come.

I don't think Duality is needed. If I don't have Convection right away, I try to make Chain, usually with with Firedog/Magma, which accomplishes basically the same thing and puts pressure on your opponent to deal with Chain or essentially lose the game. If the deck does not set up rapidly with Convection/Rekindling, it should focus on making these sorts of Firedog plays, which Duality doesn't directly enable. This is also why I feel like cards like Book and Econ are so useful in this deck. They enable Firedog, protect Chain, and, in the case of Econ, allow for some painless swipes of opposing monsters to follow up on your swarm plays.
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#82
antispiral

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I sort of feel like the "remove all your lavals and destroy stuff" trap isn't very useful in practice.
1) You need a graveyard
2) You have to not be able to make a better play using the graveyard
3) You can't have a substantial field of your own
4) some other stuff

Rekindling clears fields better, leaves you with a field, lets you draw a few cards, and keeps your graveyard live for subsequent plays.

Why can't I have a substantial field of my own?
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#83
.ben.

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As I read it, you must banish all Lavals in your GY. Assuming things have gone as planned, that is somewhere in the negiborhood of 4-6 monsters. At this point you start to get into the "Gatling Dragon" problem; i.e. if you have to destroy 4 cards and your opponent only controls 2, the other two have to be yours.

And assuming the card (like Icarus, etc.) cannot target itself for destruction, you are losing board presence.

If I am wrong on this, it'd be awesome b/c it instantly makes the card much better.

EDIT: I am wrong on this. That is good. The card isn't terrible.
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#84
Pharaoh Atem

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Reread my translation, kiddo. There is no Gatling issue.
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#85
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Ahh you are correct. Then it is certainly better than I originally gave it credit for.
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#86
antispiral

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Ahh you are correct. Then it is certainly better than I originally gave it credit for.

Yeah, with the existence of cannoneer and return, Blazing Dust/Tephra becomes a great card just because it's pretty easy to recurse shit that was removed.

It's just really versatile chainable mass removal. IDK why you wouldn't run it.
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#87
Exiled

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1 copy of tephra is all that's needed. You either have return or cannon to make use of banished lavals or its a late game out
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#88
Pharaoh Atem

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If it didn't have the cost it currently has, it would literally be very, VERY poor design without at least a slight rework. There are sane things one does when one decides to hamstring something in order to garner some other colossal stem.
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#89
Punpun

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When will this archtype be playable in the TCG?
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#90
Sanjura

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the good stuff won't start trickling in until DT13, so you're just gonna have to play on DN until then.
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#91
Sanjura

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Laggia.dek has been kicking my teeth in. There's only so many times you can force a negation only to have your power play stopped by something else that deck has up its sleeves. Any suggestions?
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#92
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Laggia.dek has been kicking my teeth in. There's only so many times you can force a negation only to have your power play stopped by something else that deck has up its sleeves. Any suggestions?


Volcanic Queen
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#93
Sanjura

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well shit may as well just play lava golem so i can hit doikka and laggia!
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#94
rishi171

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Return From the different Dimension deserves a mention; it's basically another rekindling, but better and helps you OTK more often
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#95
The Pale King

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Return From the different Dimension deserves a mention; it's basically another rekindling, but better and helps you OTK more often


Return is a staple in here.
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#96
Sanjura

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Well given the information we've been provided thus far, I'm thinking about maining Maxx "C" post-ORCS, if anything for Wind-ups. Stopping the Hunter loop before it gets going is going to be critical if this deck plans on keeping up.
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#97
Naus

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http://shriek.twoday...ories/49590043/
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#98
The Pale King

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I like the 3rd place better than the 1st place one, although both seem heavily teched-out (stuff like 3x Crow mained), as if everyone in the tourney knew everyone else and his deck beforehand. But yeah, hard to beat a 2-card combo as broken as Convection/Rekindling.
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#99
Fr0ZeN

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Well given the information we've been provided thus far, I'm thinking about maining Maxx "C" post-ORCS, if anything for Wind-ups. Stopping the Hunter loop before it gets going is going to be critical if this deck plans on keeping up.

Why not just main veiler since the loop would still be able to otk you to begin with.?
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#100
Naus

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Well given the information we've been provided thus far, I'm thinking about maining Maxx "C" post-ORCS, if anything for Wind-ups. Stopping the Hunter loop before it gets going is going to be critical if this deck plans on keeping up.

Why not just main veiler since the loop would still be able to otk you to begin with.?

You're getting 2-3 cards for them to discard 1.
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#101
Sanjura

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Pretty much what Naus said, because they won't be able to deplete your hand thus making the loop useless.

I find it kinda odd though that none of those OCG builds ran Tephra/Dust. dat trip D.D. Crow though.




and on an unrelated note, I looked up the price of Lavalval Chain and Daigusto Emeral on Ebay and lol'd.
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#102
The Pale King

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Posted Image

Current build
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#103
Zee.

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This is the build I've been messing about with for a bit of fun:


3 Tender of the Laval Volcano
2 Laval Forest Sprite
2 Laval Lady of the Burning Lake
3 Laval Cannoneer
2 Magflare the Molten Swordsman
3 Flamvell Firedog
2 Flamvell Poun
1 Flamvell Magician
1 Gorz, Emissary of Darkness
- 19

3 Rekindling
3 Pot of Duality
1 Pot of Avarice
1 Dark Hole
1 Monster Reborn
1 Heavy Storm
2 Mystical Space Typhoon
- 12

1 Solemn Judgment
2 Solemn Warning
1 Trap Dustshoot
1 Torrential Tribute
1 Mirror Force
3 Phoenix Wing Wind Blast
- 9

1 Formula Synchron
1 T.G. Hyper Librarian
1 Ally of Justice Catastor
1 Lavalval Dragon
1 Lavalval Dragoon
1 Laval the Greater
1 Brionac, Dragon of the Ice Barrier
1 Black Rose Dragon
1 Laval Stannon
1 Stardust Dragon
1 Scrap Dragon
1 Trishula, Dragon of the Ice Barrier
2 Lavalval Chain
1 Number 39: Utopia
- 15


It's been testing really really good. Not sure on the Magflares, but I just needed another way to remove the Lavals really. Couldn't think of a better option, I was gonna play a build with Rykos + Troopers + Bazoo, but this worked out alot better.
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#104
The Pale King

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I commented on your build in the OCG garage, but I would also add that Spirit of Flames/Tephra Kindling ("Blazing Dust Explosion" in fanlation) are much more efficient and advantageous ways of removing Lavals than Magflare. Magflare might have been playable if he had been a Warrior and had 200 DEF, but he's neither.
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#105
Zee.

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I commented on your build in the OCG garage, but I would also add that Spirit of Flames/Tephra Kindling ("Blazing Dust Explosion" in fanlation) are much more efficient and advantageous ways of removing Lavals than Magflare. Magflare might have been playable if he had been a Warrior and had 200 DEF, but he's neither.


Yeah, I didn't really like the look of Blazing Dust tbh, don't like the look of Spirit of Flames. I like Magflare cause it can get over T King and T King is a bit of a problem for the deck, I can't really think of any other cards to remove them. I assumed that PWWB didn't trigger Tender, it's just cause there's a few dead draws, and you can fling the other Lavals to have one in grave to use Tender. Thanks for the input <3
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#106
Zee.

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Also: Shooting Quasar OTK.

Posted Image
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#107
The Pale King

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I commented on your build in the OCG garage, but I would also add that Spirit of Flames/Tephra Kindling ("Blazing Dust Explosion" in fanlation) are much more efficient and advantageous ways of removing Lavals than Magflare. Magflare might have been playable if he had been a Warrior and had 200 DEF, but he's neither.


Yeah, I didn't really like the look of Blazing Dust tbh, don't like the look of Spirit of Flames. I like Magflare cause it can get over T King and T King is a bit of a problem for the deck, I can't really think of any other cards to remove them. I assumed that PWWB didn't trigger Tender, it's just cause there's a few dead draws, and you can fling the other Lavals to have one in grave to use Tender. Thanks for the input <3


I know it's easy to be skeptical about Tephra, but after trying it out for a long time, I think it's just too good not to run. It's a one card field wipe that also sets up Return/Cannon.

Spirit of Flames can also get over Rai-Oh, btw.
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#108
Exiled

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so twin slayer and lancelord are coming out in phsw and the first batch of lavals are coming in december

lets work
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#109
Sanjura

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this deck without molten convection and maid though = :(
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#110
Exiled

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at least we got flamvells to support what's left
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#111
byakk

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this card seems pretty cool in here. Haven't tested it yet, but it keeps multiple transmission fields from being dead and it gives the deck 2-4 more avarices.

thoughts?
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#112
Nimo

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But it's still does nothing else for the deck.

Except making flamvell deity.

As for rabbit, i'm siding 2 electric virus.
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#113
Black Ace

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3 Card-Car F
3 Laval Magma Cannoneer
3 Laval Volcano Handmaiden
3 Battle Fader
2 Laval Cannon
2 Maxx "C"
1 Laval Forest Sprite
1 Laval Lady of the Burning Lake
1 Booster Warrior
1 Gorz the Emissary of Darkness

3 Rekindling
3 Sweltering Heat Transmission Field
3 Gold Sarcophagus
3 Pot of Duality
3 Mystical Space Typhoon
1 Monster Reborn
1 Dark Hole
1 Heavy Storm
1 Foolish Burial

3 Raigeki Break

1 Formula Synchron
1 Armory Arm
1 Ally of Justice Catastor
1 T.G. Hyper Librarian
1 Laval Dual Slasher
1 Brionac, Dragon of the Ice Barrier
1 Black Rose Dragon
1 Ancient Flamvell Deity
1 Stardust Dragon
1 Scrap Dragon
1 Mist Wurm
1 Shooting Star Dragon
1 Shooting Quasar Dragon
2 Lavalval Chain
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#114
Aniodia

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I had a nice little rant, and then I accidentally closed the tab in mid-sentence. So mad I have to retype this.

First, pay attention to the dates of the topic. I can understand you want to whip your deck out and show it off, but seriously, necroposting damn near 3 months after the fact, after the meta's shifted so fucking much, makes me think you didn't read the thread.

Second, add some content to your fucking post. Any random shitstain from Pojo or TCGplayer or wherever can just toss out list after list, but here it would be helpful if you actually said something. Even if it was "hey, can a nigga get some help with a decklist, I don't want to take it in the ass from wind-ups" or some shit. If you wanted to just post a decklist, there's other subforums for that.

Third, and another thing that makes me think you didn't read a goddamn thing, is "Sweltering Heat Transmission Field". For fuck's sake, Atem took time to give better-sounding localization, the least you could do is show the man some fucking respect and use what he's given you.

As for the decklist, there's other forums for that. This is Laval - Discussion, not Laval - Spam Your Decklist With No Context. It helps if you have something to discuss besides just a decklist.

And yeah, I'm kinda ranting at this point now, but I'm drunk and your post angers me right now. IDGAF.
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#115
Dango

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I had a nice little rant, and then I accidentally closed the tab in mid-sentence. So mad I have to retype this.

First, pay attention to the dates of the topic. I can understand you want to whip your deck out and show it off, but seriously, necroposting damn near 3 months after the fact, after the meta's shifted so fucking much, makes me think you didn't read the thread.

Second, add some content to your fucking post. Any random shitstain from Pojo or TCGplayer or wherever can just toss out list after list, but here it would be helpful if you actually said something. Even if it was "hey, can a nigga get some help with a decklist, I don't want to take it in the ass from wind-ups" or some shit. If you wanted to just post a decklist, there's other subforums for that.

Third, and another thing that makes me think you didn't read a goddamn thing, is "Sweltering Heat Transmission Field". For fuck's sake, Atem took time to give better-sounding localization, the least you could do is show the man some fucking respect and use what he's given you.

As for the decklist, there's other forums for that. This is Laval - Discussion, not Laval - Spam Your Decklist With No Context. It helps if you have something to discuss besides just a decklist.

And yeah, I'm kinda ranting at this point now, but I'm drunk and your post angers me right now. IDGAF.

A necrobump of a discussion thread is always merited. Posting decklists instantly comes with the assumption he wants fixes and while him posting a few more details etc would be nice, thats not enough reason to rage at the kid. So kindly if you are going to get drunk on the interwebs and go on dgz go to CSK there is an alcohol thread there specificly made for drunk people i have been on it myself.
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#116
CheeseCake

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Monsters: 22
3x Battle Fader
3x Maxx "C"
3x Laval Cannon
3x Card Car D
3x Laval Volcano Handmaiden
2x Laval Lady of the Burning Lake
2x Laval Magma Cannoneer
2x Tragoedia
1x Gorz the Emissary of Darkness

Spells: 15
3x Rekindling
3x Pot of Duality
3x Gold Sarcophagus
3x Sweltering Heat Transmission Field
1x Monster Reborn
1x Dark Hole
1x Heavy Storm

Traps: 3
3x Phoenix Wing Wind Blast

Extra:15
1x Number 39: Utopia
1x Steelswarm Roach
1x Leviair the Sea Dragon
1x Wind-Up Zenmaines
1x Lavalval Dragon
1x Stardust Dragon
1x Scrap Dragon
1x Shooting Star Dragon
1x Shooting Quasar Dragon
1x T.G. Hyper Librarian
1x Ally of Justice Catastor
1x Brionac, Dragon of the Ice Barrier
1x Black Rose Dragon
1x Formula Synchron
1x Scrap Archfiend

Not sure about the PWWBs :/ I would rather play 2 TT 2 Warning and a SJ but I don't have the room. Also Trag is strictly better than fader in this, due to it being able to copy a lvl 1/2/3/4 and being a beatstick to sit behind when you have a bad hand or are waiting for sarcos to resolve or to activate Card Car or Duality. I also want to fit in Veiler but yeah rooms tight.
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#117
Sanjura

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I miss 3 Tengus in this deck. :(
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#118
Donnie

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Why is everyone talking about cutting Quasar, I've been playing this deck all week, and I can make Quasar about 60% of the time, within the first 2 turns, that's game my friends. It also doesn't care about Maxx C, because Quasar shits on Gorz, Trag, and Fader. If you're going for the OTK their backrow should already gone, which is easy with Lake. And as long as they have less than 3 monsters you can Lavalal Dragon them all away, for an open field.
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#119
The Pale King

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This is Laval - Discussion, not Laval - Spam

Right, and I'm glad you took the time to discuss Lavals and not just spam the thread with a shitty, irrelevant rant...

Quasar's good, but I don't know if it's necessary. If you have a grave so loaded up for Rekindling that you can make all the syncs leading to Quasar, you should probably win anyway. Plus Quasar (and esp. Shooting Star, which is useless except with Quasar) eats up a lot of Extra Deck space, which I think is better used for more XYZ options like Black Corn and Utopia Ray.


Not sure about the PWWBs :/ I would rather play 2 TT 2 Warning and a SJ but I don't have the room.

I would play all of that, with no PWWB and maybe Return. This deck really doesn't have to be played as an all-out combo deck (with 3x Sarc etc.), no more than Wind-Ups need to play stuff Junk Forward and a bunch of draw Spells to combo-out right away. It's a pretty flexible deck that can apply a lot of pressure with simple cards like Firedog, and which topdecks very well even if it gets Hunter looped.
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#120
antispiral

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Monsters: 22
3x Battle Fader
3x Maxx "C"
3x Laval Cannon
3x Card Car D
3x Laval Volcano Handmaiden
2x Laval Lady of the Burning Lake
2x Laval Magma Cannoneer
2x Tragoedia
1x Gorz the Emissary of Darkness

Spells: 15
3x Rekindling
3x Pot of Duality
3x Gold Sarcophagus
3x Sweltering Heat Transmission Field
1x Monster Reborn
1x Dark Hole
1x Heavy Storm

Traps: 3
3x Phoenix Wing Wind Blast

Extra:15
1x Number 39: Utopia
1x Steelswarm Roach
1x Leviair the Sea Dragon
1x Wind-Up Zenmaines
1x Lavalval Dragon
1x Stardust Dragon
1x Scrap Dragon
1x Shooting Star Dragon
1x Shooting Quasar Dragon
1x T.G. Hyper Librarian
1x Ally of Justice Catastor
1x Brionac, Dragon of the Ice Barrier
1x Black Rose Dragon
1x Formula Synchron
1x Scrap Archfiend

Not sure about the PWWBs :/ I would rather play 2 TT 2 Warning and a SJ but I don't have the room. Also Trag is strictly better than fader in this, due to it being able to copy a lvl 1/2/3/4 and being a beatstick to sit behind when you have a bad hand or are waiting for sarcos to resolve or to activate Card Car or Duality. I also want to fit in Veiler but yeah rooms tight.

I really liked Enemy Controller in this when I played. Being able to drop one of your more useless tuners for an opponent's beefy monster is nice. It is somewhat combo reliant, and was better when we had the Tengus and need to run fdogs, but I think it's worth taking a note of.
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