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YCS Toronto 2013 Aug 31-Sept 1st?

not 100%

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811 replies to this topic

#81
Grimey

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I wouldn't know but hasn't YCS Toronto almost always been Sept format?


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#82
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I wouldn't know but hasn't YCS Toronto almost always been Sept format?


Yep. It's also the first time it's been on Aug 31

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#83
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This is actually really lame  :(


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#84
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If its current format then I might not go. I haven't decided yet. Going into time every second match is freaking annoying.
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#85
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I was about to say they should just use common sense with regards to the format, then I realised that noone with common sense would schedule a multi-day constructed event when the format changes half-way through.


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#86
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I'm writing an article to boycott the event. Wonder how that will go over.

 

You wouldn't be the only one doing so.


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#87
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Remember all the petitions people have made in the past? What we need is to let the attendance fall, but it will never happen. Numbers keep getting bigger, so our opinion means nothing sadly =[.
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#88
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Article should be up tomorrow. FB event and group have been made. Make the noise people. Share, share, share. #OccupyYGO
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#89
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Article should be up tomorrow. FB event and group have been made. Make the noise people. Share, share, share. #OccupyYGO

I've been boycotting yugioh for 2 years, where have you been?


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#90
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Im not going #OccupyYGO


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#91
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http://josephgiorlando.wix.com/occupyygo#!ycstorontoboycott/cnec



I never thought I would write an article about something like this but alas here I am just a mere month before YCS Toronto with an endless stream of thoughts and emotions. For those of you who are not aware, and there very well may be readers out there who are not, there will be a YCS held in Toronto at the end of this month. It was officially listed on the premier event page of the Yu-Gi-Oh website a few days ago, along with the YCS in San Mateo. It has caused quite a significant uproar in the Yu-Gi-Oh community for an array of different issues, and today I feel as though it is time for us as a community to put our foot down and make a statement.

 

Before I get too far into the topic at hand, I need to make something absolutely clear. This article has no relation to the recent development between Konami and Alter Reality Games. While I may in fact be a weekly writer for ARG, the sentiments I am about to express are not necessarily that of ARG. The fact that ARG is no longer an affiliated Konami store, and the controversy surrounding the ARG Opens, was not the motivation for writing this article. I had intended on writing this article if YCS Toronto was announced weeks before the boiling point in the Konami negotiations. It just happens to be a coincidence.

 

I honestly try to sit down each and every week and produce articles which are beneficial to the Yu-Gi-Oh community in a wide variety of manners. Sometimes we talk about individual cards, analyze successful decks, or even on a lucky day end up discussing some of the advanced concepts that are prevalent in the game of Yu-Gi-Oh. This article does not follow that line of thinking. Though that not is to say that what I am about to write is not beneficial to our community. This may be the most important articles I have ever written for the community, or it could simply fizzle out. But I really do hope what I am about to say can pick up steam amongst our community because if there was ever a time to make a statement about the health of the Yu-Gi-Oh card game, today is that day.

 

So with that being said, I am writing the community today to call a boycott of YCS Toronto 2013. Konami has continued to manipulate the Yu-Gi-Oh community, and failed to address the wholesome complaints of its customers for too many years. It is beyond ludicrous to think that a professionally run trading card game can sit down and believe they have the ability to announce competitive events in the way in which Konami has just. With less than four weeks before round one of YCS Toronto Konami honestly believes that their player based will be able to find an affordable and appropriate means of travel to the event. Unfortunately we do not live in the fantasy world where last minute travel arrangements produce the prices that Konami must think. By scheduling an event with this short of notice, the bulk of players are unable to find the same priced hotels and transportation in which they would have been able to obtain had Konami appropriately announced their event months in advance. Beyond that, seeing as how they decided to announce an event out of the United States at such a last minute, players who would have originally enjoyed the opportunity to travel outside of the United States to play must already have a passport - or otherwise be forced to pay an increased sum of money for an express produced passport. It is beyond unprofessional for a company with the revenue and experience in organized play to believe they even have the right to abuse their players in this manner. Companies who openly appreciate their players, such as Wizards of the Coast, give their players more than adequate time to plan their trips in accordance with what is affordable and fit appropriately in their lives. It is almost as though Konami lives in their own world and ignores the fact that their player base actually have jobs and cannot simply drop what is going on in their lives in order to book a last minute flight and take time off of work. At most establishments of employment, a weekend off to Toronto would have already needed to be requested. So not only are we as players expected to pay more on travel expenses, we are supposed to obtain an express passport, ask for time off of work at what very well may be too short of time, and not know what format we are about to play in.

 

That is right. Konami has officially announced an event where there will be a fundamental change in the Forbidden and Limited List when the players amass for Day 2. With this glaring issue, a professional company such as Wizards of the Coast would give their players an idea what they are about to invest their hard earned money in going to. Seeing as how we are dealing with an unprofessional company like Konami, they have failed to officially declare what type of tournament their player base would even go to. So now not only are all of the limitations discussed previously an issue in attending the event, you could very well show up to an event where you would have had no intentionally of originally playing. Who knows, maybe Day 1 is Battle Pack 2 sealed. Maybe it is the March 1, 2013 Forbidden and Limited List. Another tournament for Dragon Ruler and Prophecy. I know I personally have no intention of ever playing that format again, and I bet I am not the only one who believes that. So why in the world would you want to invest your money in going to play another competitive tournament under that list? What if it is the September 1st, 2013 list? That would be exciting. How difficult if it to list what format the event is being held under? Such as simplistic decision which any properly run company would have been made months ago. But nope, not Konami. That is far too logical for a company like Konami. They leave you in the dark, no communication with their player base, no care for what are our concerns.

 

I heard rumors about this event months ago. Months ago. It was even listed on the Toronto Convention Centre website. That is right. This event has been in the works for a handful of months. Let that sink in. Konami had the intentions of having this event back when hotels were cheaper, flights were a fraction of the price and when you could have appropriately requested work off. That is the way in which Konami has decided to treat our players. Are we seriously going to stand here and allow that to be the norm? Are you freaking kidding me? What does it take to list a YCS event the moment it has officially been negotiated with the venue? As a professional company with a player base that relies on organized play (and I use the word organized loosely), there must be consistent communication. In this case there was no communication whatsoever. An absolute atrocity across the board.

 

So what are we going to do about it? We could all individually believe that we should not attend. I know I feel that way. I am sick of this treatment, and as a player who has missed only two American YCS events since 2010, I am not attending. I could ask for work off, I could afford the trip - but I am staying home. I simply cannot concede to the this treatment. And we as a community should stand up and say no. That is the only way in which Konami will ever listen to our requests. Hit their wallet. Hit it hard. It costs Konami a lot of money to hold these events. Let them look over their field of players in shock. They deserve it. They deserve to tank tens of thousands of dollars. I know this article, Facebook group or YouTube video will not be able to hold the attendance to zero. But we can damn sure try. We can try to #OccupyYGO, and if we fail - we can make noise. We can make a lot of noise. How many people have historically attended YCS Toronto? What if we can put up an attendance under 100? How about a venue filled with players but no one entering the event? or side events? A Yu-Gi-Oh blackout. Tell Konami how you feel about their event, and how they have decided to treat their player base.

Now I know, for a lot of people this is not something you want to consider. There are a lot of players who travel to each and every event. I am one of them. I am one of the people on the circuit. I schedule my year around each and every event. But the benefit of keeping yourself, and your friends at home is far beyond what showing up is worth. If we want there to be change in our game, we must be willing to make the sacrifice of this statement. Life goes on, there are more events. We can sit one out. Trust me, this is yet another event to give you the chance of finally winning a YCS or getting that first top. I know both of those feelings, one of which I live in to this day. But sometimes there are other things in life beyond that. What do we want as players? Better coverage. Live streams. Real rankings. Cash prizes. Better feature matches. Deck techs. New tournaments. Yu-Gi-Oh World Cup. Yu-Gi-Oh Players Championship. Real commentary. We want change. Let's make the sacrifice, and state what we want profoundly. It is just one event. Life continues after.

Spread the message, share this article, invite people to the Facebook group and link people to the corresponding YouTube video on my account (YGOTrader101). It is our time to #OccupyYGO. Be sure to follow me on Twitter too: @ARG_JoeG

 

 


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#92
SMercado

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I was already on the fence, but Joe has a point. Fuck it, I'll sit this one out. Really, there is absolutely no reason for these events to not be booked months to a year in advance.
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#93
Indignation

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My best friend is fucking vending. I miss when we used to play and prepare for the same tournaments together. Konami hasen't mentioned shit all for info. Rumors are it's current shit format sigh, and this whole things was revealed late. I honestly wondering what is the point of going? I was invited to go camping that weekend too so maybe I will go camping with instead. My motivation for this ycs is at an all time low. I usually am siked for ycs toronto but now I'm like i dont give a fuck.


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#94
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i am going because it's the only canadian event of the year and i don't want to risk losing it with low attendance lol
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#95
Asura • The Fearful One

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i am going because it's the only canadian event of the year and i don't want to risk losing it with low attendance lol


And this is why #OccupyYGO will fail: because players will view their 1 opportunity to play in Konami's shitty event as a golden opportunity to win when the attendance will be low. We have to remember that YCS are, in Konami's eyes, a glorified local.

I don't fault you, Exhale. There's nothing wrong with taking advantage of lower attendance if you want to win the event.

There simply won't be enough people not going to this to truly matter. Instead of 900-1000 players, maybe they get 600-700 players. If Konami is already taking a hit, I doubt that they will care enough. It also has to be multiple, consecutive events that are boycotted. I mean, no more than like 300-400 players. Otherwise, it amounts to nothing more than a child threatening to hold their breath for forever. 300 players skip an event, everyone's back in 3 weeks. Nothing happens. For this reason, Joe, your article should call for the boycott of all regionals and YCS until Konami changes.
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#96
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I think exhale meant that he doesn't want YCS Toronto's to stop happening period


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#97
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Konami should realize their faults at a low attendance, not associate that with Canada
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#98
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a public protest may work better maybe we can all meet an event on friday and rally in a group to the big front table with signs and stuff 


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#99
Exhale

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i am going because it's the only canadian event of the year and i don't want to risk losing it with low attendance lol


And this is why #OccupyYGO will fail: because players will view their 1 opportunity to play in Konami's shitty event as a golden opportunity to win when the attendance will be low. We have to remember that YCS are, in Konami's eyes, a glorified local.

I don't fault you, Exhale. There's nothing wrong with taking advantage of lower attendance if you want to win the event.

There simply won't be enough people not going to this to truly matter. Instead of 900-1000 players, maybe they get 600-700 players. If Konami is already taking a hit, I doubt that they will care enough. It also has to be multiple, consecutive events that are boycotted. I mean, no more than like 300-400 players. Otherwise, it amounts to nothing more than a child threatening to hold their breath for forever. 300 players skip an event, everyone's back in 3 weeks. Nothing happens. For this reason, Joe, your article should call for the boycott of all regionals and YCS until Konami changes.
 


I clearly meant I didn't want Konami to cancel YCS Toronto events of the future because of a low attendance this year....My chances of winning are literally not changed at all if the boycott happens or not. I still play 10 rounds and still need to win 5 rounds in top lol.
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#100
Exhale

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Konami should realize their faults at a low attendance, not associate that with Canada

Konami should do a lot of things that they do not, that's why you're boycotting the event in the first place isn't it?

If you were boycotting EVERY event until they did something, then maybe I would skip out on Toronto...but a commitment to just boycott Toronto is pointless to me seeing as it's one of 2-4 that I get to go to every year lol.
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#101
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a public protest may work better maybe we can all meet an event on friday and rally in a group to the big front table with signs and stuff 

 

I was thinking this actually.

 

i shall send my e-concerns


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#102
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boycotting events is not the way to effect any kind of change by konami. YCS events are not integral to the game's profitablity, despite what most competitive players seem to think. if YCS events cease to be worthwhile financially in konami's eyes, then konami will stop holding YCS events. they lose nothing, and the players lose their events.

 

konami makes their money by selling cardboard for ridiculous prices. if you want the company to change its ways, try boycotting their products.


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#103
Asura • The Fearful One

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Except that Konami doesn't sell cardboard at ridiculous prices. Players do. Not buying their product won't make a difference in how OP is run. No matter what, our best shot at good OP is going to be ARG.
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#104
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Except that Konami doesn't sell cardboard at ridiculous prices. Players do. Not buying their product won't make a difference in how OP is run. No matter what, our best shot at good OP is going to be ARG.

 

are you familiar with the concept of the booster pack?

 

konami is a business, and they make their money by selling yugioh cards. if people stop buying those cards in protest of shitty organized play, konami is more likely to change organized play than they would be were they faced with a boycott of YCS events.

 

yugioh would still be an unimaginably profitable game if there was never another YCS event ever. konami cares about selling packs, and the best way to get them to listen to you is to try to interfere with that. if you want a company to notice you, you hit them in their wallet. boycotting YCS events doesn't really make any sense: it relies on konami caring enough about organized play to take notice, and yet the boycott is only being staged because konami doesn't care about organized play.


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#105
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Anybody remember when events only had 400-800 people and most were even 350 at the best of times yet there were still events. I'm sure if attendance is low they wouldn't really care as I doubt they make much money but the tournament organizers will care.
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#106
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^ This and what other marcus said.


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#107
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Anybody remember when events only had 400-800 people and most were even 350 at the best of times yet there were still events. I'm sure if attendance is low they wouldn't really care as I doubt they make much money but the tournament organizers will care.


From what I heard here and there, Konami actually doesn't even make that much money when attendance is high. Some people I've talked to say they even take a neg just to hold the events. That seems unlikely, but if its anything like that then Konami won't care if people attend Toronto or not.
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#108
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They do lose money, the goal would be to make them lose more at which point they either fix the problems or cut the whole thing... and knowing how shit of a company they are they'd just scrap t2 events altogether
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#109
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If this movement happens more then once you better believe it effects them and they'll start caring overall. I do agree with the whole boycott thing but with that said 1 event wouldn't be enough to really get your word out. I guess the best thing is to see if it will effect events in America since it usually has the biggest turn outs and as a company of course they'll take notice.


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#110
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The whole thing is just not something I would expect from Joe. His points are valid, but a lot of the logic is flawed.

"Konami doesn't care for events"
"LETS BOYCOTT EVENTS"

"Konami needs to treat players better"
"LETS HURT TOURNAMENT ORGANIZERS AND NOT AFFECT KONAMI IN ANY WAY"

konami does in fact take a minus on YCS events, but it's a small cost for keeping a player base happy and , tournament organizers make more money than Konami does on these events. boycott the products. don't buy judgment of the light or something would have been a way better boycott than let's fuck over all the canadians and not go to their event. SJC Montreal got 300 players and they never held another one again. If you fuckers make us lose Toronto as well I'll probably just quit lol
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#111
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as someone said at locals yesterday ygo players will always want more in the end


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#112
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boycotting events is not the way to effect any kind of change by konami. YCS events are not integral to the game's profitablity, despite what most competitive players seem to think. if YCS events cease to be worthwhile financially in konami's eyes, then konami will stop holding YCS events. they lose nothing, and the players lose their events.

 

konami makes their money by selling cardboard for ridiculous prices. if you want the company to change its ways, try boycotting their products.

Who are they hoping to buy said cards for "ridiculous prices" if the only people paying that much are the people wishing to compete in higher level tournaments? If competitive yugioh goes away Konami would take a huge losee. You're living in a konami fantasy world if you think the competitive side isn't very important to them


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#113
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boycotting events is not the way to effect any kind of change by konami. YCS events are not integral to the game's profitablity, despite what most competitive players seem to think. if YCS events cease to be worthwhile financially in konami's eyes, then konami will stop holding YCS events. they lose nothing, and the players lose their events.
 
konami makes their money by selling cardboard for ridiculous prices. if you want the company to change its ways, try boycotting their products.

Who are they hoping to buy said cards for "ridiculous prices" if the only people paying that much are the people wishing to compete in higher level tournaments. You're living in a konami fantasy world
 
 


what? that's irrelevant to them. Konami makes exactly zero dollars from the secondary market that is ebay/individual buying and selling. the selling cardboard for ridiculous prizes meant selling a pack with 9 cards that cost them less than a dollar to make for $5. That's a huge mark up and ridiculous profit margin. All Konami cares about is selling packs. Boycotting an event will not make them sell less packs. it'll maybe slow down the secondary market for a little bit and cost the tournament organizers a couple thousand dollars but that is it.
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#114
Brandon Wigley

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you're not getting it, the competitive yugioh players are what spike sales..... look at the last set for instance, dracosack and judgment day were the 2 cards all competitive players were looking for. So obviously stores buy/open more product searching for said cards to sell them as singles to players. I guarantee if you look at the profit margin Konami made from the last set compared to a horrible set such as cyber dark impact it'd be a pretty big difference. Reason being? There were chaser cards that competitive players wanted in one and not the other, hindering sales for cyber dark impact and other sets like it


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#115
Marcus

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boycotting events is not the way to effect any kind of change by konami. YCS events are not integral to the game's profitablity, despite what most competitive players seem to think. if YCS events cease to be worthwhile financially in konami's eyes, then konami will stop holding YCS events. they lose nothing, and the players lose their events.

 

konami makes their money by selling cardboard for ridiculous prices. if you want the company to change its ways, try boycotting their products.

Who are they hoping to buy said cards for "ridiculous prices" if the only people paying that much are the people wishing to compete in higher level tournaments? If competitive yugioh goes away Konami would take a huge losee. You're living in a konami fantasy world if you think the competitive side isn't very important to them

 

 

maybe rethink your post a little bit. if the competitive side of this game was 'very important to them', then they would care enough about attendance to tell players about events in a timely fashion, and this boycott would never have come into place.

 

konami makes nothing off the secondary market, and most of their sales come from kids buying packs and playing with thier friends at a local level. the number of people who play this game competitively are in the minority. we don't matter; if we did, konami would pay attention to us.


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#116
Exhale

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you're not getting it, the competitive yugioh players are what spike sales..... look at the last set for instance, dracosack and judgment day were the 2 cards all competitive players were looking for. So obviously stores buy/open more product searching for said cards to sell them as singles to players. I guarantee if you look at the profit margin Konami made from the last set compared to a horrible set such as cyber dark impact it'd be a pretty big difference. Reason being? There were chaser cards that competitive players wanted in one and not the other, hindering sales for cyber dark impact and other sets like it

i'm not denying that competitive yugioh players spike sales, but Joe is not boycotting their product. He is boycotting an event while still planning to participate in the ARG Open Series which will be held in September. Will he buy less cards cause he's playing in the ARGOS than he would have if he was playing in the YCS? fuck no, he's going to buy the exact same amount of cards and packs and etc and konami will take no hit. Joe isn't going to quit yugioh, he's just boycotting YCS Toronto.
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#117
Brandon Wigley

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I don't see how the secondary market having an indirect impact on Konami and their sales goes over everyones heads


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#118
Brandon Wigley

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you're not getting it, the competitive yugioh players are what spike sales..... look at the last set for instance, dracosack and judgment day were the 2 cards all competitive players were looking for. So obviously stores buy/open more product searching for said cards to sell them as singles to players. I guarantee if you look at the profit margin Konami made from the last set compared to a horrible set such as cyber dark impact it'd be a pretty big difference. Reason being? There were chaser cards that competitive players wanted in one and not the other, hindering sales for cyber dark impact and other sets like it

i'm not denying that competitive yugioh players spike sales, but Joe is not boycotting their product. He is boycotting an event while still planning to participate in the ARG Open Series which will be held in September. Will he buy less cards cause he's playing in the ARGOS than he would have if he was playing in the YCS? fuck no, he's going to buy the exact same amount of cards and packs and etc and konami will take no hit. Joe isn't going to quit yugioh, he's just boycotting YCS Toronto.

But someone (not sure if it was you) brought up that if the attendance got to low Konami would just brush off YCSs and the competitive side of yugioh because they make little to no money off of the events which is very narrow minded

 

edit: went back and looked, It was marcus who said that and he's 100% wrong


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#119
Exhale

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that's not going to happen and whoever said that is not very bright lol. my point is that as long as competitive Yu-Gi-Oh! exists SOMEWHERE. Whether it be Regionals, ARGOS, or YCS, the secondary market will remain unharmed and packs will be purchased.
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#120
Soul

Soul

    I'm Makaveli's offspring, I'm the king of New York

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actually that's not completely true. i think it's pretty naive to think that the competitive aspect to the game is overlooked by konami. the entire reason of the YCS circuit and printing of these broken cards is to get those hyper competitive people to buy. part of the reason why they sell any of the amount of volume they do is because; a.) little kids watching the show need their cards, and stores pick them up and b.) people looking for certain cards in the set. the cards in the secondary market simply do not pop out of mid-air. they are there because competitive players are buying boxes and cases searching for the cards that are most profitable or usable for them. most of these highly sought after cards end up in the secondary competitive market for a reason, and there is a reason why we see these 100+ USD price tags on a single card.

 

im not going to sit here and say it is definitely going to hurt konami's pocket if they stopped the YCS circuit completely. they will still make money off of the little kids looking to get into yugioh and build their utopia decks. the flipside to this which i think mr. wigley is failing to understand, is that the game might still go on without a YCS circuit. there will still be glorified locals and regionals, and probably a nationals and world championships. you will still need to search for and purchase these cards if you wish to play this game in any competitive capacity even after the YCS circuit is done for. 

 

tl;dr: konami does make money off the competitive market, it's just not where you guys are seeing it. it doesn't have to be from the secondary market, because they are the entire reason there is one. they influence it almost entirely which is why you always have people bitching about rarities on certain shit. the only question that begs to be asked is how much of their revenue actually comes from each of these sales and if that number is even substantial enough for konami to care. the other question is if competitive players will actually cease their play of ygo and subsequent purchasing of cards if the YCS circuit stops. the latter i highly doubt.


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